Norm - Where everybody knew your name ....

Hilary · Post by **Hilary** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:07 am

Hi

i cant talk for the GLL-Servers, these are hosted by iF.

Then i dont understand. The GLL Servers nearly have the same IP number as your server and they are still "unreachable" in my list .... Your Armagetron.de has the IP 81.169.154.148 as can be seen on beta.armagetronad.net/serverlist.php. The GLL servers have almost the same IP. Maybe iF could shed some light on this ?

some single ip's (no ranges!) are firewalled by my sshd - these are automatically "banned" ip's after more than 3 failed login-attempts.
and i dont believe that you or one of your friends ever tried to brute-force my server, did u?[/b] no - you wont be such a nasty frood - i'm still sure, that you're a nice person.

Very funny. I don't give a rats ass about your server or your sshd. I told you i stopped playing on it.. I wanted to connect to Christis Server, not yours. Fact is that all servers with IP 81.169.. are unreachable to me and other guys from the same provider. But those servers are online and players are on it. People from other Internet providers can connect to the servers and also see them in the masterlist. I can't. So someone must have done something.

This evening i went to a friend again. He has the same provider. And also he can' t connect to your server nor does he see your server in the list as reachable. Both, his and my IP start with 84..... Could you please explain that to me ?

feel free to play there whenever you want to

That's the point Sylv - i simply can't because you don't let me. I can connect or see any other servers except your Armagetron.de or the GLL servers.

, as i told you before: it's just a game - i cant take your recriminations personal, Norm. this may offend you, but it's just my point of view - accept it as it is: no sherrif's on my server, no rules, and a lot of ninnies - you have to live with

I don't believe you Sylv .. and no, i am not offended. I simply can't be offended by you.You are not that important. I am only surprised and disappointed how far you go for "just a game". And no, you are definately not a nice guy. That i know for sure now.

If there is a temporary technical reason for all that and it was not you, i will be the first to apologize here in this forum. But right now i have no reason to do so.

Norm

Post by **Lucifer** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:12 am

Hilary wrote: Very funny. I don't give a rats ass about your server or your sshd. I told you i stopped playing on it.. I wanted to connect to Christis Server, not yours. Fact is that all servers with IP 81.169.. are unreachable to me and other guys from the same provider. But those servers are online and players are on it. People from other Internet providers can connect to the servers and also see them in the masterlist. I can't. So someone must have done something.

This evening i went to a friend again. He has the same provider. And also he can' t connect to your server nor does he see your server in the list as reachable. Both, his and my IP start with 84..... Could you please explain that to me ?

Nearly the same IP != the same IP

Ask your ISP what the problem is. If everyone you know with the same provider is having the same problem with a range of IPs, then your problem is with your provider, or with the person who actually owns the range of IPs in question, which would be iF's and Sylv's provider.

Dogging on Sylv over it would be...jumping to conclusions. I remember asking waaay at the top of this thread if maybe you were jumping to conclusions, and I remember you saying you wouldn't do that.

If there is a temporary technical reason for all that and it was not you, i will be the first to apologize here in this forum. But right now i have no reason to do so.

Looking forward to your apology.

Sylv · Post by **Sylv** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 10:11 am

Lucifer wrote: Nearly the same IP != the same IP

some technical details:
the domain armagetron.de and the gll-servers are hosted by iF (81.169.181.123)
my domains armagetron.game-server.cc, ironheel.de and my Game-Server are hosted on my own Server (81.169.154.148)
not the same ip's!
whe're both using the same provider, but these are two independent dedicated servers! i didnt ask iF about, but i'm sure, that he didnt ban anyone - neither did i.
ask your provider about your technical problems, or ours (strato / serverkompetenz.net).

Norm, please tell me just one thing: what makes you so malicious?
the discussion started about the simple fact: i have changed the admin-pw on my server -
and know this thread is a dump full of insults and false recriminations.
You call me "arrogant", "stupid", "simple-minded", "liar" -for what? what have i done to YOU? You must be out of your mind.

Walking Tree · Post by **Walking Tree** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:54 am

sylv: norm has reasons (I'm not saying good reasons) to dislike you.
we have a great community, and for quite a time now, you have been a pillar on which a part of the community rested. This is, as far as I know, the second time you just threw the part of the community you held off. First you stopped mirroring tiger network classic play, a server which I myself played a lot on. This was no very big deal, since there was still the real classic play and it was obvious that yours was not the official server. Now you destroyed the athmosphere on your server by changing the admin password. This affected Norm, as a respected in-game admin directly. So Norm is, understandably, very angry at you, and, as many people in a rage, is prone to jump to conclusions.
We cannot and will not try to force you to support us. But the determination with which you ignore the community is infuriating to some of us.

for reference: My provider is T-Online (TDSL2000). my IP is currently 84.153.73.86 . I have no problems connecting to armagetron.de. maybe there was a problem that is fixed now, maybe T-Online manages different areas seperately.

Hilary · Post by **Hilary** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:38 pm

Hi Lucifer

Lucifer wrote:Nearly the same IP != the same IP

True. I was wrong about that . Sorry.

Ask your ISP what the problem is.

There is none, i checked that. Look, this is going for 3-4 days now. So this ain't any technical glitch or something.

If everyone you know with the same provider is having the same problem with a range of IPs, then your problem is with your provider, or with the person who actually owns the range of IPs in question, which would be iF's and Sylv's provider.

Well, Sylv says, there is no problem with his provider. There is also no problem with my provider Why should my provider block his subnet ? Would not make any sense.

Dogging on Sylv over it would be...jumping to conclusions. I remember asking waaay at the top of this thread if maybe you were jumping to conclusions, and I remember you saying you wouldn't do that.

Also true, but i really thought long about it. Just enligten me with your wisdom: What would you think if you were me ?

Looking forward to your apology.

Hmm, could take a long time. I think it's pointless. He says he did nothing - I still have no access to that servers. I think i can live with that now, i have to, i guess ....

Norm

Hilary · Post by **Hilary** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:53 pm

Sylv wrote:Norm, please tell me just one thing: what makes you so malicious?the discussion started about the simple fact: i have changed the admin-pw on my server

No Sylv, it is not about changing the password. It's about how you did it. You can't treat people like that. Only very very arrogant people treat other people that way. Only people who don't give a damned about others do it like you did. And thats what really upset me. I dont care about that admin stuff. I dont need it to play. I have always been asked if i wanted to be an admin. And i always said yes. Why not. Not a big deal. Yes, this maybe just a game. Good, i got that. But beside that game there are real people playing and even a good community developed out of this game. Never forget that.

But i repeat myself ... it's pointless to tell you.

Norm

Post by **Lucifer** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 7:17 pm

Hilary wrote:
Ask your ISP what the problem is.
There is none, i checked that. Look, this is going for 3-4 days now. So this ain't any technical glitch or something.

A technical glitch can last indefinitely.

If everyone you know with the same provider is having the same problem with a range of IPs, then your problem is with your provider, or with the person who actually owns the range of IPs in question, which would be iF's and Sylv's provider.
Well, Sylv says, there is no problem with his provider. There is also no problem with my provider Why should my provider block his subnet ? Would not make any sense.

Spam, viruses, etc. There are a surprsing number of ISPs that block various subnets for various reasons.

Also true, but i really thought long about it. Just enligten me with your wisdom: What would you think if you were me ?

You're asking the wrong guy.

No matter how much I hate someone, or how mad I am at them, I still don't leap to conclusions. I try to think the best of everyone, even my most bitter enemies.

Looking forward to your apology.
Hmm, could take a long time. I think it's pointless. He says he did nothing - I still have no access to that servers. I think i can live with that now, i have to, i guess ....

At this point I'm not seeing you differentiating yourself from him. Why do you come back here just to flame someone? If it's clear to you now that you're not getting an apology, why bother fighting him? What's the point? What do you gain from it? What does he gain? Haven't you got better things to do with your time than whine about some server admin you're mad at?

(or is it about time to start linking to a nearly endless stream of posts complaining about norm as an ingame admin. Your hands aren't clean, so settle down)

Post by **Tank Program** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 8:50 pm

Lucifer wrote:A technical glitch can last indefinitely.

I've had routing issues that lasted weeks and which resolved themselves as mysteriously as they arrived.

newbie · Post by **newbie** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 9:33 pm

Oscilloscope wrote: Sure, you can do a regular 180, always could. You can even do a 180 grind/paperclip if you double-tap it rather than double-bind it, always could, but it's not guaranteed. What you can't do (or, at least, shouldn't be able to do) is a double-bind 180 grind/paperclip. And that's even truer now than it was when bounce was in play because sometimes even then someone would get away with some double-bind 180 grinds. Now they can't (or, at least, shouldn't—sometimes one gets lucky).

IMHO this is the same shit as double binded 180, people do it to get high speed, no difference

IMHO the map is too small, 5 newbs (;-)) and the purpose changes from 'kill' to 'survive'

newbs get away not with doublebind 180 but with going straight to the rim, they cut you off and than they wait for players who will die on the outer rim

if you wanna kill them, you have to do 180 to go between outer rim and their wall

now this is very funny, people start thinking '180 on every rim, LOL',

and you have to do this, if you wanna kill and not just WAIT for some space to kill

anyway at present i belive in a one map, circular map (with killzone getting smaller and pushing players to each other)

bye

Phytotron · Post by **Phytotron** » Sat Dec 24, 2005 10:50 pm

Shrunkland is Shrunkland, and I don't think you're going to change that. It's still not a very speed-friendly or 180 grind-friendly server, even with the allowances I described. Yes, players can double-tap a 180 grind, just as they could in the old Shrunkland, but they can only do a couple in a row. In practice, it's not an effective tactic, is only about as good as a regular grind for gaining speed, and they usually explode themselves anyway.

The arena is small for a reason (like, duh, "Shrunkland"), and is by no means too small. You're mad if you think it should be larger.

The outer rim is, from what I can tell, even touchier now than it used to be (and fortunately, is no longer susceptible to ripping). I generally avoid the rim, so it's difficult to say with certainty, but I'm fairly certain this is true.

If you're having trouble with players on the rim, I'd say the problem is yours and in your particular approach to attacking them, which I find ridiculous. I'm bugged by rim huggers, just because I think it's a lame tactic, but I don't have any trouble with them and I think that's in large part because I don't attack them in any way that you describe.

Finally, if you don't like it, don't play there. Pretty simple.

However, I think you would be hard pressed to find another server that is less friendly toward speeding, 180 grinds (whatever the sort), and rim hugging. Perhaps z-man's Fortress, perhaps that Genk team play server that has recently popped up, but that's all I can think of off the top of my head.

newbie · Post by **newbie** » Sun Dec 25, 2005 12:11 pm

Oscilloscope wrote: If you're having trouble with players on the rim, I'd say the problem is yours and in your particular approach to attacking them, which I find ridiculous. I'm bugged by rim huggers, just because I think it's a lame tactic, but I don't have any trouble with them and I think that's in large part because I don't attack them in any way that you describe.

big guy, i wasn't talking about problems with rim-players

, i wasn't even talking about any problems

when you have 8 opponents and you are closed from both sides you can wait if you are passive or just go with some 180 to the rim, arrive to the other side (your opponents side) and then attack

this is just chasing your runner and on the beginning has nothing to do with attacking

hehe, anyway, do not speculate about me

Walking Tree · Post by **Walking Tree** » Sun Dec 25, 2005 2:18 pm

maybe this thread should be split into a "setting preferences and problems" part and the original topic about community/sylv situation and, later, ISP stuff,

iF · Post by iF » Sun Dec 25, 2005 7:22 pm

hm - lol.

Hilary wrote:
... i found out that Sylv is now blocking me (and others) from his servers. This affects not only his Armagetron.de but also the GLL Servers.

Hm - lol.

This thread here to to complex for me to understand.

I do not understand why somebody have any problems connecting Servers.

Any everytime.cfg of any gll-server is with a size of 0 bytes.

In the case i want to block some nickname - simply i do it. And i do not have to explain it - simply i do it.

I think we have to stop talking about adminpasswords or connecting-problems. Its kiddy.

If Sylv does not longer want somebody knows his serveringamepassword - then its simply his choice you have to understand.

Iam changing my ingamepasswords often - and if somebody (players they play often on gllservers) asks me for the ingame-password - i simply give the password. And if i feel bad bc to much ppl have the password - i simply change it again. And again, again ....

Its my choice - and nobody ever got a problem with it.

The actual ingame-password of all gll-servers is "gll3"

This Thread loox like some ppl does not understand: armagetron is a game.

Walking Tree · Post by **Walking Tree** » Sun Dec 25, 2005 7:36 pm

iF wrote:armagetron is a game.

we al know that, we just take this game more serious, to some extent more personal than others, for example you and sylv.

The radical way sylv showed this shocked and hurt norm. I am only an innocent bystander who can completely understand norm, vertigo and others with similiar views.

it's not just a game, it's a social game. if you want a non-social game, go to a project with bad or no networking support. gltron perhaps.

Storm · Post by **Storm** » Sun Dec 25, 2005 10:59 pm

I dont normally writes in forum but this time i have to. please excuse my english.

@iF

You should read before you post

Its not about passwords or admins anymore if i read this looong thread corectly.

@lucifer

Calm donw

@norm, sylv

I am also a congster provider and i also not have the server in my list. it always says "unreachable". That is not a real problem because i not play there, so i did not care. but i was now curiouss after readin this thread. so i checked the IPs from my linux computer as well. my ip is always starting with 84.182.x.y - always!!. Only x and y is changing each time of 24 hours.i tried to contact sylv server on 81.169.154.148 .. no response like from a firewall in stealth mode. all other IP nummers can be reached like 81.169.154.147 - no problem. So norm is wrong about that - only one IP is not available with my provider. i think sylcv make a mistake in his firewall and blocking the ip 84.182.x.y by accident ? is this possible ?

i think you all should calm down . maybe all this is caused by a stupid accident and nothing more. maybe sylv or if can check this very easily.

cya on Tigers Classic

Storm