~Misc Stuff~ Decision Overturn

[Z-Man]

Oh right, that was a request? DO IT. FORK!

Lucifer: The next gen display server, Mir, is already in use on the Tablet version. Regular X applications use the compatibility layer XMir. It's available as beta on regular Ubuntu. What's annoying is that Ubuntu are rolling their own there: The other distributions have a different solution. Same with application packaging, they invented yet another self contained application format, a wonder it's not called yascaf. There's a high risk of harm done by this fragmentation.

Nice double standards Z-Man

Why, thank you! Though I'd be interested to hear how you go to that conclusion. I count eight instances of the forum filter kicking in in the removed post. Insults all around. Can you find a post from a banned user we let stand that was worse?

And you're confusing people having power and mattering. None of us have power over the forums, only Tank has. But all voices matter. Just look back at the suggestions for enabling the probation for new users. We got that a bit later.

[Lucifer]

Oh right, that was a request? DO IT. FORK!

Lucifer: The next gen display server, Mir, is already in use on the Tablet version. Regular X applications use the compatibility layer XMir. It's available as beta on regular Ubuntu. What's annoying is that Ubuntu are rolling their own there: The other distributions have a different solution. Same with application packaging, they invented yet another self contained application format, a wonder it's not called yascaf. There's a high risk of harm done by this fragmentation.

That might account for your latency, actually. But, um, more than Ubuntu is onboard with Mir. It's complicated, it's not as cut and dried as the change from XFree86 to X.org, I get that. There's controversy, and Ubuntu thinks they're going to lead....a herd of cats.

Nice double standards Z-Man

Why, thank you! Though I'd be interested to hear how you go to that conclusion. I count eight instances of the forum filter kicking in in the removed post. Insults all around. Can you find a post from a banned user we let stand that was worse?

And you're confusing people having power and mattering. None of us have power over the forums, only Tank has. But all voices matter. Just look back at the suggestions for enabling the probation for new users. We got that a bit later.

I'm disappointed that I missed all of that. I scrolled back looking for it, but you know, I'm kinda busy, so I didn't look real hard...

[Light]

I cannot because my servers are set up using sty+ct. I do not, and likely will never have +ap
because it's a dead project that hasn't been receiving updates in quite a long time now.

The direction I will likely move is towards 0.4 in the (possibly distant) future, when more +ct
function gets put into stock 0.4, which is supposed to be happening sometime semi soon.

Sorry about that.

Except for using +ap and lying about it to you because he assumes you're ignorant on the topic . oh and funny cause you don't have any power and you're pretty much an irrelevant smuck without a voice, so I must sadly inform your that your opinions matters not.

https://code.launchpad.net/~armagetrona ... -sty+ct+ap

Or, I'm using sty+ct and being honest about it, and you don't know enough about what you're talking about to actually see that.

Code: Select all

# ./armagetronad-dedicated --version
This is armagetronad-dedicated version 0.2.9-sty+ct_alpha_r793.

And I must be relevant enough for you to bring up messages from months ago, in which no changes have been made since before that message anyways.

[Light]

-IRC: The default app for that is Desktop Mode XChat with enlarged UI elements. It works quite well.

This may be off topic, if that's possible in this thread, but HexChat is a fork of XChat and seems to work a bit more smoothly. Also, XChat is no longer supported, and along with that news, Ubuntu has removed them from the repos, and HexChat is the given alternative. I've only started using it today, but my connection appears to be more stable than with XChat, which was really the only thing I could have complained about.

I guess to blend it in with the topic. If you make something better and provide support for it, you'll end up winning people over.

[Z-Man]

HexChat is a fork of XChat and seems to work a bit more smoothly.

That's neat, but as you could not yet install desktop apps on the OS version I had and the connection losses are to be blamed on the system itself, not actually helpful
I got quassel-core to work on the raspi. It gives me the one thing I wanted most, a persistent presence and chat backlog that is shared between the tablet and the PC. Well, I started out not knowing I wanted that. Before the tablet, I was perfectly happy just being on IRC when one of the PCs were running. But a tablet is powered on 24/7, right? So why not be on IRC all of the time? But then I'm taking the tablet with me and don't always have network, WHAT THEN? That's where the ZNC bouncer came in. BUT THEN I noticed two flaws: the bouncer iself has all of the chat history in its logs, but only shares it with any client once. So I would never get the full chat on the PC. That can't be! Plus, messages sent while your connection is timing out are LOST to all clients. Worst case scenario! Someone might think they sent me a message and I read it, but I didn't! GAAA! I guess next time, I'll just stay happy with the very imperfect solution
I'm still using AndChat side by side with Quassel. Quassel is good enough, but the UI is not perfect. It's functional, because it's really, really hard to get IRC completely wrong, but you can't swipe to switch between channels, it does not automatically reconnecct to the core on network changes (the current beta apparently does) and a lot of the core's features are not accessible from the Android client. NickServ passwords, for example. That's of no concern to me, ZNC handles those already.

So anyway, the setup is now:
ZNC on the raspi connected to freenode
quassel-core on the raspi connected to ZNC
quassel-client on the PC (there's a Windows version too, I think, gotta try that) connected to quassel-core
quasseldroid on tablet and phone connected to quassel-core
whatever other IRC client I settle on, probably AndChat, connected to ZNC

Overkill is fun.

Oh yeah, I have to mention IRCCloud. It's great as a standalone client, has good chat backlog, and they offer a bouncer service that keeps you virtually online the whole time. For 4$/month, the price of a cheap VPS. Yikes. And if you don't pay, you can't connect to your own bouncer. Anyway, if I had more money than joy of tinkering, i would have settled for that.

I'm disappointed that I missed all of that.

You need to look into the trash bin.

[Monkey]

You're the epitome of the failure within the own system you want of meritocracy

EXILE HIM!!!!!! HE SPEAKS AGAINST THE SYSTEM!!!!!!!!

Chillout son, I don't think you've grasped the workings of the system of which you speak. Remember the following:

...you're confusing people having power and mattering...all voices matter.

Seeing as this thread is now more off topic than it is on topic:

...more than Ubuntu is onboard with Mir. It's complicated...

Oh, how so? How is the future of Wayland looking these days? I just assumed that people would get sick of Shuttleworth/Canonical/Ubuntu et al constantly doing their own thing. I'm a bit out of the loop since I left Linux a while back however the future of OpenBSD will probably depend on the outcome of this stuff as X.Org will no doubt need to be replaced by something else.

[sinewav]

I just assumed that people would get sick of Shuttleworth/Canonical/Ubuntu et al constantly doing their own thing.

Since we are so far off topic already, I remember reading that high-end game developers with an interest in Linux will drive development of any new window system. Canonical's desire to rub elbows with giant corporations like Microsoft might come in handy if a partnership can develop something good that the entire Linux ecosystem can use. I still have lots of problems with video performance and weird bugs no matter which compositor I use, so I am looking forward to stepping into the modern age with Linux.

[Lucifer]

I just assumed that people would get sick of Shuttleworth/Canonical/Ubuntu et al constantly doing their own thing.

Since we are so far off topic already, I remember reading that high-end game developers with an interest in Linux will drive development of any new window system. Canonical's desire to rub elbows with giant corporations like Microsoft might come in handy if a partnership can develop something good that the entire Linux ecosystem can use. I still have lots of problems with video performance and weird bugs no matter which compositor I use, so I am looking forward to stepping into the modern age with Linux.

Besides what sinewav wrote, which pretty much sums up the situation, we have this crazy situation where we're talking about replacing a significant piece of UNIX. Let's not lie about it, this is a piece of UNIX, the X Windowing System. X.org is just the latest organization to be working on it, but it all goes back to the same protocol.

The current drive for a better system isn't driven by Shuttleworth/Ubuntu. It's driven by need. And it's not just desktops that are needy about it. Google wants it for Android, Shuttleworth wants it for Ubuntu, Redhat needs it for whatever Redhat does (still not sure what they're doing), etc.

So, there's that.

On a side point: Sinewav: This is an excellent example of threads intentionally taken off-topic by others (in this case, me and z-man, and a few people that have helped along the way). So, we're not off-topic. We've thrown away the topic.

[Z-Man]

Kind Sir, I would like to protest to that preposterous accusation. I for my part was merely giving a reason for my recent silence, the rest flowed naturally.

Nah. Actually, gently leading ugly threads astray is probably the best way to deal with them. Silly comics are a close second.

Last bit of Quassel-news: Yep, the Windows client works fine. And on the tablet, I installed the most recent version from F-Droid. It fixes all the issues I had. Well, you still can't swipe to switch channels, but the channel list is now always visible. That's even better. And it has something else no other Android IRC client I tested had: The option to turn of the status bar icon if there is nothing to report. I think I settled in.