Wiki for events has to go

[nux]

Given the recent issues in ladle, i think its time we move to a more adapted-to-our-needs system. This is what i have in mind.

Steps to signup to a ladle from scratch:

• Any user can start a clan
• Clan leader can invite to and kick people from the clan
• Clan leader can invite temporarily players as subs and will be kicked once ladle finishes
• Clan leader can signup the team to the upcoming ladle once its enable by an admin/cron
• Clan leader can select ladle leaders (independent of clan leader)
• An admin/cron will close the signup mode, after this, leaders are not allowed to sign the clan up.
• Similarly, players cant be added to the ladle once player signups has been closed (could be same time as above).

Once the signups close, the script will generate the brackets using existent tools.

There are a few pros to using a "custom-made" system.

• Nobody will be able to edit the teams once signups are closed.
• Nobody will be able to sign on two teams
• There will be no need to check if given GIDs are valid
• Players wont be able to add to a clan they dont belong to
• Leaders wont be able to signup people who are not in the clan
• This could be later used to something else, such as groups

Coding this is not hard at all, and i can do it myself, if thats what the community wants.

So go ahead, tell my why im wrong.

PS: i will be editing these lists as we go.

[Tank Program]

Not the person to say if it's a bad idea or not, but I will just point out that someone will have to run it, which quasi defeats the purpose of a self-organising tournament. It also (as outlined) has no audit trail - on the Wiki you can see exactly who's done what. Would be cool to use the web-based GID authentication system instead of registration.

[kyle]

I sorta had a similar idea a while ago http://forums3.armagetronad.net/viewtop ... 60&t=20633

I have some code someplace for it.

[sinewav]

[*]An admin/cron will close the signup mode, after this, leaders are not allowed to sign the clan up.

You don't even need an admin for that. Sign-ups close at a specific time every month. You can just set a timer and automate it.

We've talked about the benefits of a custom site for a long time. It needs to fit into the open framework we have here. All the code needs to be accessible. There needs to be a way for people to contribute easily.

If this is really that easy for you to code, then I say go for it! When you have something, show us and we will figure out how to work it into the world of Armagetron. In the thread kyle linked to above there was even talk of an Armagetron.net subdomain. As long as the code is available to all and there are enough people with access to the site there shouldn't be any problems.

Also, one thing that might be helpful is having the site write an activity log of sorts.

[Cody]

Being apart of ladle since ladle 18. I had to post.

Steps to signup to a ladle from scratch:

1.Any user can start a clan
2.Clan leader can invite to and kick people from the clan
3.Clan leader can invite temporarily players as subs and will be kicked once ladle finishes
4.Clan leader can signup the team to the upcoming ladle once its enable by an admin/cron
5.Clan leader can select ladle leaders (independent of clan leader)
6.an admin/cron will close the signup mode, after this, leaders are not allowed to sign the clan up.
7.Similarly, players cant be added to the ladle once player signups has been closed (could be same time as above).

1.I believe any user can start a "team" that will represent at least 4 confirmed players* playing.
2.Team leader can invite & hold responsibility to kick people from the team.
3.Not sure why this is added, everyone knows how subs work. They certainly don't have to be removed after ladle finishes, let the team roster reflect who played in the ladle.
4. It already works like this, we wait for someone to update the page for next ladle.
5. Team Leader is selected by a common majority among the people on that team(or the person who takes the time to organized the team and post it on the wiki)
6. Already works like that.
7. DISAGREE, I think team leaders hold the right to update the roster if for any instance there are changes required to be made.(only on ladle day though)

I'm mean really it would seem by now we're all over the age of 16(i would even go as far to say majority of us are over 20) and don't have to deceive people.
Team Leaders have a responsibility to update their team on the wiki to the correct players playing, aswell do the actual players on that team, guess what you signed up on one team and don't wanna play for them? remove yourself.

example:
If vov is signed up on Team A and he plays for Team B. PLEASE this gives ANYONE the right to remove his name from Team A to Team B.(after this action, post on the forum with a screenshot of him confirmed playing for team B and not team A)

Now, if vov didn't wanna play for Team A and wanted to play for Team B and just doesn't tell Team A, Team A can take internal action against vov.
Also vov as a player has a right to which team he plays for, he also has a responsibility to remove his name from Team A to Team B.

We're all matured on here(I hope).

If you wanna do an alias team that's fine, just remove the current players off from the other teams(if they're signed up.) If you wanted to deceive your clan mates and lie to them, well I'm sure internal action should be taken against you.

[nux]

It also (as outlined) has no audit trail - on the Wiki you can see exactly who's done what. Would be cool to use the web-based GID authentication system instead of registration.

It will use the GID and keep a history of all events.

[*]An admin/cron will close the signup mode, after this, leaders are not allowed to sign the clan up.

You don't even need an admin for that. Sign-ups close at a specific time every month. You can just set a timer and automate it.

That is what a cron basically is, a task to be run on a particular schedule. The similarity with Tron is unrelated.

We've talked about the benefits of a custom site for a long time. It needs to fit into the open framework we have here. All the code needs to be accessible. There needs to be a way for people to contribute easily.

Code will be available on LP.

Being apart of ladle since ladle 18. I had to post.

1.I believe any user can start a "team" that will represent at least 4 confirmed players* playing.
2.Team leader can invite & hold responsibility to kick people from the team.
3.Not sure why this is added, everyone knows how subs work. They certainly don't have to be removed after ladle finishes, let the team roster reflect who played in the ladle.
4. It already works like this, we wait for someone to update the page for next ladle.
5. Team Leader is selected by a common majority among the people on that team(or the person who takes the time to organized the team and post it on the wiki)
6. Already works like that.
7. DISAGREE, I think team leaders hold the right to update the roster if for any instance there are changes required to be made.(only on ladle day though)

1. Im not talking about joining a lader in that point yet. This is just registering a new clan. Whether or not the clan is activated is another thing. The "4 players or more" rule would go on point 4.
3. They do need to be removed from the clan, as they are just subbing. Ladles will save the roster, even if the clan is edited afterwards.
4. I know it already works like this, that doesnt mean is the best way.
5. Not always the clan leader will be the one who will be the team leader on ladle auth.
6. Same as 4. And no, people are still able to edit the templates once signup is closed.
7. That will be up to the rules, not your opinion, nor mine.

Players wont be able to add to a clan they dont belong to. Leaders wont be able to signup people who are not in the clan. If player A from clan X wants to play for clan Y, he can leave X and join Y and be signed up with them. Then its up to clan X to invite back or not.

We're all matured on here(I hope).

Speaking of this, dont bring all that drama over here. This is a discussion about using wiki for events, not who is wrong or right regarding previous ladles.

[sinewav]

I guess there is a small issues with relying on too much automation. If there are sudden rule changes, it may be hard to get the code for the site updated in time. We'll need even more dedicated, talented people who can bang out code quickly and easily. Editing the wiki is tedious, but pretty much everyone is capable of doing it. Just something to think about.

[Cody]

I think there's a confusion here about what you think ladle is nux.

You keep mentioning the word "clan" when Ladle is a team based tournament, a clan can sign-up a team but also people can create free-standing teams.

I think we should keep the rules at the moment cause any changes to them would do more harm and add confusion than good. The wiki doesn't have to go anywhere.

[nux]

I guess there is a small issues with relying on too much automation. If there are sudden rule changes, it may be hard to get the code for the site updated in time. We'll need even more dedicated, talented people who can bang out code quickly and easily. Editing the wiki is tedious, but pretty much everyone is capable of doing it. Just something to think about.

As far as i know, there wont be sudden rule changes, only scheduled changes. The system for the code will work in the same way as arma's. There will be a group capable and able to edit the code and push it online as soon as they want. My system would be easily configurable, maybe not all of it, but simple things such as dates for signup process, max players per team, etc. But in order to make this configurable, we need to think of every modification that could possibly done to the rules, to "think ahead" and avoid re-coding something if the rules change.

I think there's a confusion here about what you think ladle is nux.

You keep mentioning the word "clan" when Ladle is a team based tournament, a clan can sign-up a team but also people can create free-standing teams.

I think we should keep the rules at the moment cause any changes to them would do more harm and add confusion than good. The wiki doesn't have to go anywhere.

Clan, team, same thing. This is not what we are discussing here.

I didnt say "lets change the rules", i said "lets make a system which will enforce the rules". This is the problem with the wiki, everybody is free to edit it, whether they would be breaking the rules or not. In a custom-made system, only those changes which follow the rules will be accepted.

[PokeMaster]

Mind if I ask who the hell you are and if we can confirm/deny any past identities? Monorail episode of the Simpsons, anybody?

[Cody]

Mind if I ask who the hell you are and if we can confirm/deny any past identities?

++++

We don't need a system to enforce the rules, we have a community that's been doing it for the last 4 years

[nux]

Mind if I ask who the hell you are and if we can confirm/deny any past identities? Monorail episode of the Simpsons, anybody?

n on the grid, Pnoexz on IRC. No past identities for me.

[sinewav]

n on the grid, Pnoexz on IRC. No past identities for me.

Welcome to the forums!

[epsy]

Sorry but isn't what you are describing exactly the purpose of http://at-x.asdf.ch/tournaments ? (example)

[Cody]

Sorry but isn't what you are describing exactly the purpose of http://at-x.asdf.ch/tournaments ? (example)

http://1v1sb.weebly.com/

we're ahead of our time epsy! lets get a cocktail and cheers!