Ladle 24 Voting Discussion

[1200]

Are we missing any other topic?

Admins (or captains present)
___force
______start
_________of
____________the
_______________match on time, regardless of if the teams are ready or not....

This would have to come in effect at some point if we deem ourselves to be organized. Despite all the talks being carried out, if matches don't start on time there will be a delay.

[2020]

@1200
definitely

[Hoax]

+1 on what goody said
someone less lazy than me should create the topic(s)

[compguygene]

OK, i have been watching this thread without posting for a few weeks now. I really didn't feel that I had anything of value to add to the discussion, as others seemed to represent what i might say. But, now I do. Somebody please just propose an actual short list of stuff to vote on and let's start a voting thread. Realistically, it is the 16th of the month. We should be done organizing the voting within a week from now. To do that, somebody needs to step up and start bringing closure to this thread and start a new one that will come to a vote! I would NOT like to be the one to do it, since I think others here are better qualified than me. But it we don't stop what is becoming pointless debating at this point, I am really gonna start to try to force the issue! I really would like to see us have a vote done by Monday or Tuesday of next week so we can put more effort into discussing other issues. But I think, at this point, we are almost starting to go around in circles.

[sinewav]

You're all right, this is getting out of hand. And like Goody said, any one of these could have a meaningful impact. Maybe we can just say:

"Which method to reduce game-time is most appealing?"

1. Use LIMIT_TIME
2. Earlier start time for Ladle
3. Split Ladle into two days
4. Finals are best of 3
5. Bouts are one match only to 200 points

This is still a lot of choices and might not generate a clear winner. But maybe like Pike said earlier, we can have everyone put them in order from most-to-least desirable (most desirable is 5 points?), and see if that makes the winner more obvious. In the case of LIMIT_TIME, earlier start, and split days, we'll need to have a second, quick round of voting (ed's idea) if either of them win.

How does that sound?

And I've been meaning to make a voting thread, but I wanted to do it after we had a L-24 wiki page up. I'd do that myself, but I... er... don't know how.

[epsy]

or go back to faster-paced settings instead of voting things that will slow down the pace

[owned]

These are what I think we should vote on (the other topics are at a near consensus.)

Brackets:
-top 2 seeded
-top 4 seeded
-3rd place match
-no 3rd place match
-random assortment

(this next part is from sine)

"Which method to reduce game-time is most appealing?"
-Use LIMIT_TIME
-If so, do you want it to be 10,15, or 20 minutes a round?
-Earlier start time for Ladle
-
-Split Ladle into two days
-Saturday and Sunday
-Opposing Sundays
-Finals are best of 3
-Bouts are one match to 200 points


Keep in mind the sub-points are only placed into effect if the point it corresponds to is voted on. If two or more votes are even, then all other ones are canceled away and people vote on those.

[dlh]

I think this is getting too complicated. Anything that changes the basic structure of the matches shouldn't be voted on right now, like LIMIT_TIME and “Bouts are one match to 200 points”. There have been no servers running to test those setting.

They can be voted on after more testing and discussion is done, but I think the Ladle is not the best stage to introduce these changes.

Here is what I think should be voted on right now:

Seeding: random, top 2 seeded, top 4 seeded
Ladle start time: same as always, 1 hour earlier, 1.5 hours earlier
Finals are best of 3 matches: yes, no

Maybe splitting the Ladle into two days can be included, but someone needs to come up with concrete choices and times.

[compguygene]

dlh raises a valid point about settings that need to be tested.

However, just ask an i will put up a server/servers to test said settings. Can be in Europe or the US.

[pike]

They can be voted on after more testing and discussion is done, but I think the Ladle is not the best stage to introduce these changes.

Good point.


I think we shouldn't vote on seeding right now, since there was no new discussion about it and random brackets work well.

[Van-hayes]

Well if we have all the topics we need to vote on, how about someone starts the actual voting thread this weekend? We are about 2 weeks away from the ladle now so the voting should start soon.

[1200]

Anything that changes the basic structure of the matches shouldn't be voted on right now

What about admins (captains) forcing start of match on time??? This doesn't affect the structure of the matches.
I really would like to hear the opinions people like Sinewav & Durka who are really active in this forum.
What are your guys thoughts?? (and everybody else offcourse, i've said this like 3 times already and it seems like nobody wants to back it up or turn it down except Zman & 2020 who are both for it.)

[madmax]

What about admins (captains) forcing start of match on time??? This doesn't affect the structure of the matches.

Yes, I think that's essential too.
But I also think that the most serious delays aren't caused by captains not starting, but by a team that's still playing another match...

[DDMJ]

Admins (or captains present)
___force
______start
_________of
____________the
_______________match on time, regardless of if the teams are ready or not....

Let's say the quarter finals start at 19:30 GMT and it's 19:25 GMT. Team captains should be responsible for sorting their teams. Once the clock hits 19:30 GMT, there should be a final call: "CT are you ready? DS are you ready?" Allow for a few minutes (2-3) for last minute shuffling, but try and start the match ASAP. You should allow up to 5 minutes MAX, but after 19:35 GMT, the match should really start.

[1200]

But I also think that the most serious delays aren't caused by captains not starting, but by a team that's still playing another match...

Yes thats probably true. But i have experienced the most serious delay on several occasions because a match didn't get started on time as well. I think a couple of Ladles ago, we won the first round and it was time to play the 2nd round but the other 1st round match that should have been finished hadn't even started due to the disorganization of one of the teams.

It's especially important that the matches start on time for the first round matches for the obvious reasons. I think once the players have played the first round and advance, they stick around and usually matches do continue smoothly.

You should allow up to 5 minutes MAX, but after 19:35 GMT

I really don't see the point of giving extra 5 minutes. If anything, do the final call 5 minutes earlier. Starting on time means starting on time.
I know its kinda strict but i feel that because its loose now that players show up late thinking they will wait to start the match for them.
I mean even if we implement this it doesn't mean that the late comers can't play, it just means they'll join a match that already started.