Ladle 49

Mkay1 · Post by **Mkay1** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:25 pm

If you guys are serious about making fort fun, fast paced, and quicker again, ban the sweepbox (or sweep defense)

.
Easy and effective solution.

-*inS*- · Post by **-*inS*-** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:40 pm

Arbitrary rules that need enforcement by the players and not the game usually never work - look at DF, what a joke lol.

Without tinkering with settings, we're stuck where we are. I suppose we could wait a few ladles and see what happens, one ladle isn't enough of a sample to justify changing anything I guess.

þsy · Post by **þsy** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:55 pm

Come on guys, we all know how it is... Ladle becomes super defensive, so then you get super offensive.. Then a new style of defence makes it super defensive again, so then you develop a new style of offensive strategy.. Then another new style of defending happens, so then we.. ?

Another solution is to make a dog fight tourney with ladle settings. Then maybe we'd enjoy having those fights in the middle whilst we wait for the sweep boxes to finish!

ElmosWorld · Post by **ElmosWorld** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:09 pm

I guess it was just our team that had trouble with CT LIV. I know Wildcat and fingerbib were having trouble along with myself.

As for the whole server crashing in the middle of the round, is there an easy way just to replay the whole round, take the scores back to where they were before the round started?

owned · Post by **owned** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:12 pm

þsy wrote:For example, there have been complaints about CT USA and CT INW, so they could be ranked last. CT LIV on the other hand was beautiful to play on (as dariv said), so this alongside CT MBX could be ranked higher and therefore used more frequently than the crappy servers.

I think you got a little carried away with writing CT.

INW's server is not CT.

Desolate · Post by **Desolate** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:16 pm

Still, banning the sweepbox doesn't solve the problem unless both teams are using the tactic every round. In the previous ladle in our matches against uNk, their team used a sweepbox every single round, but none of the rounds were particularly long. Instead, the rounds ended up being 5v4's at our zone while I basically circled the sweepbox to keep those 2 players from getting to our zone. Every round usually entailed uNk holing our defense, where the round would resort to an imbalanced sumo situation that usually ended relatively quickly. Either the zone would be ganked and they would win, or we would win and then hole the sweepbox.

INW · Post by **INW** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:39 pm

I noticed quite a few times, a team would have a sweep box and an extra sweeper, leaving only 1 attacker. After a few round with ct...err was it sp?... doing it, we decided HELL! putting 2 or 3 at attack isn't doing much so let's just kill their 1 or 2 attackers!

-*inS*- · Post by **-*inS*-** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:41 pm

þsy wrote:Come on guys, we all know how it is... Ladle becomes super defensive, so then you get super offensive.. Then a new style of defence makes it super defensive again, so then you develop a new style of offensive strategy.. Then another new style of defending happens, so then we.. ?!

Has that actually ever happened? The past 25 ladles or so have been getting increasingly defensive, I think this cyclical pattern is a pipedream.

@Deso it's 3v3 outside of the sweepboxes and with 2 skilled teams they will do it every round, no holing, no sumo, just a 3v3 dogfight in the center.

Cronix · Post by **Cronix** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:48 pm

INW wrote:I noticed quite a few times, a team would have a sweep box and an extra sweeper, leaving only 1 attacker. After a few round with ct...err was it sp?... doing it, we decided HELL! putting 2 or 3 at attack isn't doing much so let's just kill their 1 or 2 attackers!

I guess it was us

owned · Post by **owned** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:57 pm

Cronix wrote:
INW wrote:I noticed quite a few times, a team would have a sweep box and an extra sweeper, leaving only 1 attacker. After a few round with ct...err was it sp?... doing it, we decided HELL! putting 2 or 3 at attack isn't doing much so let's just kill their 1 or 2 attackers!
I guess it was us

I don't think it was though. Mym rarely had more than 1 non-sweepbox sweeper back, and usually had none. And when they had a sweeper back, that person almost never killed our attacker.

Probably SP.

theroze · Post by **theroze** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:59 pm

Find a way to center to "block" the sweepbox, and there we are at going offensive again.

EDIT: One round at the finals were both mYm and SP were using sweepbox and both teams didnt really fail, the round took about 5 minutes, ending up the sweepbox being like a little outter defense while one guy was stuck in the zone who was originally the inner defense, so psy was quite right. New defensive tactic, now invent a center tactic or a different offensive one to not let a team build a sweepbox.

Concord · Post by **Concord** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:04 pm

I'll be scouring the recordings for the best plays of this ladle, so those players can get some recognition for their abilities and balls.

I know of a couple off the top of my head, but obviously didn't see all the matches, anyone have suggestions?

owned · Post by **owned** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:25 pm

I feel like I had a good round in the semis vs. mym where I got a small part of the front of their zone and basically held off like 3 mym players for a few minutes and then captured the zone. It's a little bit long but it can be edited. My memory might have embellished how good it was though.

Kijutsu · Post by **Kijutsu** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:31 pm

Concord wrote:I'll be scouring the recordings for the best plays of this ladle, so those players can get some recognition for their abilities and balls.

I know of a couple off the top of my head, but obviously didn't see all the matches, anyone have suggestions?

To prevent SP from sweepboxing Spin holed their #2 (or #3, can't recall) at the grind, I went through and centered. After that I stopped blocking center and we both went for Dreadlord (their center). : ) That were the only offensive tactics in the ladle finals.

vov · Post by **vov** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:42 pm

theroze wrote:Find a way to center to "block" the sweepbox, and there we are at going offensive again.

Centers officially work

(did so against SP several times ^^)
An "early torping the sweepbox while the def hasn't set up yet" should also work (we tried that once but were too slow :p)

but maybe that's the new ladle fortress: 2 sweepboxes, 3v3 dogfights in the arena till the sweepboxes are too small and the winner of the middle fights attacks... I would not like it

(maybe bad or noobish) Suggestion: A smaller/different shaped/whatever new map that can make a) dogfights more entertaining and faster (less space?) and/or b) sweepboxes and multi-layer-defenses less effective or less time consuming (less space, other zone placements, obstacles?) or even c) demand new skills from the players. I have no exact ideas of how that map could be (except the above) and, hell, I don't even think the majority of fort players would like it that way (like "wtf what is that f*king pillar doing there?!?"), but it's an idea (to make fort less defensive and for rounds to last shorter)

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