The Fortress

[KamP]

Jeez
Do ALL of your posts in this topic have to be about a page long, printed?

[Lucifer]

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[KamP]

haha, just making sure
Maybe someone could copy/paste the info here to some kind of fortress Wiki section?

[Lucifer]

I started doing that one time, but found that the information here is so poorly organized it would almost have to be rewritten. I'd like to see it done, though. I refer people to the wiki when they're new to fortress, and the ones that go read the wiki and come back generally do better than the ones that don't. Those last guys get kicked, usually.

[MaZuffeR]

But if you're all alone, or your fighting 2 v 2 with the other enemy attacking your zone, you can do it. You have to go in a direction opposite the goalie's rotation. So if he's going clockwise, you go counterclockwise. Never grind the goalie's wall! Also, never grind your own wall! Trace a spiral. You'll be going very fast, but with each rotation of the goalie's, he's losing space.

I'm not 100% sure I understand what you mean here, but if I understood correctly I must say that you're wrong. If the goalie is any good he won't let you make a spiral around him, he will grind your wall and you will have to turn back, outwards, inwards is far to risky in that situation. Then your own wall will help the defender for a while and he can make his box a bit bigger.

The tactic I use in 1 v 1 situations very much depends on the defender. If it's a good defender who rarely leaves a gap between his tail and bike I usually just circle him until one of us make a mistake. If the defender often leave a gap I usually try to build up speed (one way or another) to get through the gap safely and then just start mazing in the zone and/or try to force the goalie out of the zone.

[Lucifer]

Ahhh, I didn't say it was a good tactic to begin with, just how to do it if you want to try it. You're right, of course, the goalie should grind your wall as soon as he sees it. There may be reasons he can't, though, for example if, as the result of a previous attack, he was forced to spiral in a little bit, and you come on him in that magical time period before he's reconfigured his wall from the previous attack.

Generally, as you'll see me saying on the grid, it's a *bad* idea to surround the other zone with your wall. To make any distance inward on the goalie, he has to give, and if he's not giving, you're just making his defense stronger.

One trick I've been doing lately that works is I've been walking around part of his wall (approximately 1/2 of it, a little less, actually). When I reach the end of the part I've staked out for my own, I go back on the outside to my tail and follow it in. This time I try to flatten my wall where it's near the goalie's wall. Then I turn around and grind on my own in that little space. If I have the opportunity to cut off the goalie at this point, I will. If not, follow my tail once and grind again. Mix and repeat. One of two things will happen, eventually. I'll either get in around the goalie (at high speed) and force the zone from him, or I'll have whittled away enough of his zone that I can sumo the rest from him, or just conquer it as a result of his having to get out of it occsionally to keep his own maze large enough to survive in, or I"ll have enough space for a teammate to occupy with me and conquer it together.

[gnorty]

been trying to evolve my technique into something similar, but als my death rate is about 90% and the remaining 10% is where the goalie spontaneously combusts!

Until I get better at geting my fat ass through tiny moving gaps I am stuck with annoying the hell out of spectators with my safe but effective wiggling

[2020]

you guys are a gass

i was wondering if people would mind
if i tried to attract newbies to contributing their ideas
perhaps set up some practice
to generally improve the team-play in fortress

the potential is amazing

i have found a site
which purports to be non-clan affiliated
and it is more a player's forum
than this place
which can be a little intimidating
since most of you regulars are
1
good players
and 2
the developers

please check out the posts at
http://www.armagetroncompetitors.com/mo ... forum&f=14
and evaluate whether this might be a more newbie-friendly environment

[
ok ok
you have heard of the place...
but do you see?
it proves my point:
it is less for you pros and more for noobs
]

[Tank Program]

If we all went there and posted, wouldn't it just look a bit like here then? And therefor the difference between here and there is the difference in pepople?

(Or something like that?)

[~*PsYkO*~]

The first, foremost, and almost only, is the missile.
Here everyone piles up on the middle guy, and lets fate take care of the rest, whoever gets through the blockers gets through. It works excessively well, though the other team stays in the game with dumps, not enough usually.
The obvious solution to the missile is putting up a lot of walls, and that works pretty well. The only good ideas in this case is to get your apologies ready, and grind on the opposing walls
If you grind to left, look for holes from past collisions and go in those, if you grind right, go around and find whoever's been making these walls (if it's gyl, tell him kamp sent you) and dump him righteously. No one likes a party pooper
for the most part though, once you've gotten past the main group of ppl you're basically safe

Lol this is kind of funny to read now because for those of you that were in fortress like 3 pm today my team (gold team) was trying this strat just for fun cuz we sucked really bad...it actually worked like 3 out of 12 times

[Lucifer]

1 out of 12. Of the two times you credited this tactic with working, one of them turned into a fight in our zone, where it was decided, and the other turned into a 1 v 1 fight in their zone. Sure, we won while doing that tactic, but only 1 out of 12 times did it cause us to win, the other 2 wins were for other reasons.

I'm disappointed, actually. I think we could have done it better. We'll try it again sometime.

[2020]

so
we call it the missile?

i have experienced it working a few times
and the trick is
not to try it 12 times
but to use it occasionally
specifically
when it is obvious the opponents only have one or two walls in defence
or
they are pressing their defensive walls together
so blowing up against one wall takes out several at the same time

i would love to play a game where point nominates a missile strategy

and
to add to the complexity of another thread regarding teamtalking
i think the gameplay would improve
if there were players who were watching
who also interacted with the players
(
i specifically envisage a game where
the players are limited to cockpit view
and these 'coaches' have freeform camera control
to get the better perspective
perhaps one specialises at the impact zone
and how the teams approach the centre of the grid...
)

[~*PsYkO*~]

Lol 2020 that would take some MAJOR coding!

If that would become like a regular strategy, 2020 that would be pretty cool...Like as much used as a hole. Just yell out /team MISSILE FORMATION...than everyone knows what we're doing..grind tight and lets it fly. But man if that goes into mainstream that will be the 3rd thing I have made popular lol..1) double backing (first to do it on day 2 of fortress), 2)going down center (wasn't the first but i made it a very effective strategy)


Luci -- lets try it when you me and like vanhayes are on the same team so we can coordinate. I called the other two factors of the missile because a member holed in their def then another flied right in so it was a cause.

[Lucifer]

Ok, I'm game. Here's what I observed from back in the goal, though.

Two defenders are needed. Since your whole team is going down the middle without turning, the other team will come on in a huge rush. One goalie isn't enough, they'll flood the zone before your team's missile can get through. So two goalies are needed.

The round we won that Psyko and I agree was a working missile had me and Ghost Rider in our goal, mazing. We both turned back immediately and just mazed in our own respective halves of the fortress. This meant we could cover the whole fortress in half the time it would otherwise have taken, and we had two defenders inside the zone at the same time.

Obviously you need some strong goalies to pull that off.

I'm not entirely sure what they did to pull off getting the missile all the way through, but the idea is to end with at least two cycles injected inside the other team's fortress. If you don't get at least two in there, then there's no benefit to using this tactic compared to just going in with a wingman and making a hole for him.

[2020]

If you don't get at least two in there, then there's no benefit to using this tactic compared to just going in with a wingman and making a hole for him.

surprise