Tronathon

[dlh]

Unlocked. Some more posts may be split into a different topic.

Keep it civil.

[Nanu Nanu]

Oh and just to put my 2 cents in about df rules being stupid -- the art of DF is to be able to kill someone by touching the walls as little as possible. It's a different way to play the game and a lot of people find it very fun. If you've ever watched two good DFers 1 vs 1 before it can be a beautiful thing to watch, and it takes a lot of skill to be able to core dump someone without touching the walls. Players in DF servers know what the rules are, and if you don't follow them then yeah they don't want you in the server (especially if you don't care one bit to start with). Players aren't going to just kick you out because you're winning though -- that's ridiculous.

Someone here understands DF and is willing to explain it properly, so thanks for that.

For this DF isn't a game mode discussion: When I drive on the road, I have the option of following the rules of the road (speedlimits, traffic signals/signs, etc). Say I think some of these rules are silly because they aren't enforced by how fast my car can go; I could break them if I choose, but there is a chance of me getting caught. If I get caught, I will get punished. I'm sure most of you can understand this. In dogfight, I have the option of following the rules of the server (backdooring, sealing, stabbing, etc). Say I think some of these rules are silly because they aren't enforced by the coding of the game; I could break them if I choose, but there is a chance of me getting caught. If I get caught, I will be kicked from the server or suspended. The players really do become the "Player Police" in this case. I do hope most of you can understand this, because I can't think of any way to explain it clearer.

Back on topic: Ratchet is probably right about the tron community being unable to cross the game mode barrier and unite, at least for now. I suppose it's still too early to suggest such a tournament, so for now it would probably be best to stick to the idea of a CTF/Sumo/Fort tournament. I had hoped most of the low rubber players wouldn't look down on the game modes HR/DF so much, even if they would probably get beaten by the "pros" of those game modes. I do still hope that one day players from different game modes will come to respect the other game modes for the things that make it unique and set it apart from the others.

EDIT: Thanks for unlocking. This discussion was getting a bit out of hand though.

[Gazelle]

tronathlon sounds like an amazing idea..

sorry for the original post if anyone saw it..

Wasnt offensive to anyone in anyway, just stating the obvious.. but i realized the obvious doesnt need to be restated.. so in attempt to keep the rest of this topic civil and about the tronathlon i removed it..

Good luck with this Nanu, sounds like an amazing idea

[sinewav]

Gaz I hate to point out the obvious, but... Not following rules in DF causes you to win whereas team killing causes you to loose. You want to be a loser? Go ahead and TK your team next Ladle and see what happens. This is part of what Cody is saying, the rules and their punishments are built into a well developed game (like Fortress). You break the rules in Fort you get punished by losing. This is the opposite of DF where outcome is decided by humans with biases. It's like boxing (another terrible "sport").

Players aren't going to just kick you out because you're winning though -- that's ridiculous.

Yet it happens. I've been kicked out of DF servers a couple times for winning. It's why I don't bother with them anymore.

But regardless, why do you even have to rip on the game mode? Do you really care that much about what other people do? It's their server and it's their game mode so you follow their rules if you're playing with them.

The discussion is about a tournament that includes DF. Any opinions are fair game, in fact, they should be welcomed. It is my opinion that DF is not a tournament level game mode because of arbitrary enforcement of rules, rules that can't always be followed. Ever try to play open and maze with a bad Internet connection? Occasional sealing is unavoidable. So if I'm in a DF tournament and I seal because of lag, how is that decided? Referees can't know if I lagged or not. Also, why should a player refrain from camping and back-dooring? If you want me dead, come and kill me sucka!

[woof]

Personal shots = weak cmon gurl

Anywho DF is an established gamemode with an established set of rules. Debating it is futile and if you don't like it nobody is forcing you to play it


Nanu great idea!

[Soul]

You won't win in Df if you don't obey the rules, you will end up like Cody crying on the forums about not winning a tournament he cheated in.

In dogfight tournaments if you get a kill off an illegal kill you are simply slapped the points. Good players don't do these illegal moves often, mostly newer players have this problem.

[Gazelle]

Okay sine.wav, if u think so my friend

But boxing was good back in the day. With Tyson yo.

[prema]

wow 4 pages on DF ... lol ... what an exciting read

I agree with Ratchet, let's just omit HR and DF, and do a Tronathon consisting of Fort/Sumo/CTF ... DFers / HR people don't really get themselves involved in starting their own respective tournaments (at least recently, not too keen on the past).

A quick glimpse at the Brawl / Ladle challenge boards gives me a total of 11 teams (CTa and CTb are considered separate teams). 54 players are signed up for SBX, of which I'm not going to go through the effort and separating them into clans.

To keep it simple, and to fulfill the purpose of introducing people to gametypes, here is a suggestion: Let's replace a specific tournament day with a tronathon day.

For example Month 1 would be practice, Month 2 would be the Ladle part on whatever day Ladle is played (1st sunday of the month). Month 3 is practice, Month 4 would be the CTF part on Brawl day (2nd Sat/Sun of the month). Month 5 is practice, Month 6 would be the Sumo part on SBX day (third sunday of the month).

Of course we could also do everything in ONE month - Ladle (week 1) / CTF (week 2) / Sumo (week 3) / Party for everyone at the champion's frat house (week 4). But that seems too challenging and might be a bit hard for people?

Finally, we could just do consecutive months, rather than dividing each event with a practice month (ie. Month 1 = Ladle / Month 2 = CTF / Month 3 = Sumo)

The extra work would probably be in setting the wiki up and maybe coming up with some extra rules if necessary (basically how to determine the winner, etc.) .. other than that we could ask those who contribute their servers for these monthly tournaments to also help out in the tronathon too...

Of course we could also extend this and have multiple 'trophies' -- one goes to the actual champion clan/team that won the tronathon, and the others come from "the player's choice", where we get to vote for the team that performed the best in each respective event. The latter part is an extra amount of work, just because it is going to be impossible for each person to vote, but we could just post in each clan's forums and what not...


These are just random suggestions ... I haven't given this much thought myself but just wrote this in the "flow" ...

ETA: my biggest concern is finding the right date. In the last brawl (played on a saturday) we had more teams, compared to this month's brawl - 4 teams... any suggestions?

oh and Fipp ...

[orion]

Box a bad sport? ha.
Anyway you can win in any sport if there isnt a ref. You can win passing forward on Rugby, scoring on offside position in football, touching the red in Tennis, etc..
So thats how DF Works, punishing players that doesnt follow rules.

Btw, is there a "grind at start" rule? because you get kicked in Fortress if you dont do it.

[scene]

Players aren't going to just kick you out because you're winning though -- that's ridiculous.

Yet it happens. I've been kicked out of DF servers a couple times for winning. It's why I don't bother with them anymore.

Well of course you're going to win if you don't follow the rules while everybody else is, it's a lot easier to kill someone when you don't have to trap without touching But you were kicked for not following the rules, not for winning.

But regardless, why do you even have to rip on the game mode? Do you really care that much about what other people do? It's their server and it's their game mode so you follow their rules if you're playing with them.

The discussion is about a tournament that includes DF. Any opinions are fair game, in fact, they should be welcomed. It is my opinion that DF is not a tournament level game mode because of arbitrary enforcement of rules, rules that can't always be followed.

This is fine, your opinion on whether or not it should be in this tournament is welcome. But that doesn't mean you need to use it as a chance to rip on the df community simply because you don't like the game type.

Ever try to play open and maze with a bad Internet connection? Occasional sealing is unavoidable. So if I'm in a DF tournament and I seal because of lag, how is that decided? Referees can't know if I lagged or not.

Whenever someone stabs or plugs or anything the referee just takes the point away. It's not a big deal really. Most DF people can 1 vs 1 without a referee anyways and be just fine as long as they both understand the rules of DF well and are honest. For this kind of tournament though since there would be people who aren't as familiar with DF, a ref is just there to make sure points are counted correctly, not to punish someone for accidentally stabbing.

[scene]

On a related note, it might be kind of cool to get a server going that rotates settings and holds a sort of "mini tournament" for this. I don't think df could be included in this because of the rules aspect. So that would leave fort, sumo, ctf, hr. Not sure how you'd be able to split up the points to see who personally does the best from fort and ctf (maybe kill points + split up zone points for players that are alive?). Would take some thinking, but could be a cool idea and could be used to see if people would actually participate in something like this that goes across different game modes!

[Nanu Nanu]

I think that's enough arguing about DF and its rules for now. Maybe someone could start a new topic elsewhere if you'd like to debate it further (which could be interesting if people don't troll each other).

I think a six month tourney as Prema suggested is pretty long. A 3 week (+1 party week) tournament would be kinda hard to do and people would get burnt out. The 3 month idea would probably be the best. Practice months wouldn't be needed because there would probably be a good amount of time after this is officially announced until it starts. Dates could be hard. I'm not really sure when would be the best time for this, but if it's using the established tournaments for results, then I guess it could be done whenever. However, I do think that the sumo portion of this should be a 3v3 WST style thing rather then a sumo bar SBX tournament. This would keep everything nice and focused on teamwork like in ladle and brawl

[Clutch]

Well one thing is for sure, if this tournament happens everyone's going more tryhard than ever before \o/

[scene]

I agree with above. I think it would be best to keep this at Fort/Sumo/CTF -- at least to start off with.

A suggestion as far as teams go, teams of 6 competing players (can also have subs) so that works with fort and ctf. Then for sumo this is just an idea but two wst like rings (Separated perhaps to prevent leaching -- and players can shuffle to match up) to accompany all 6 players from each team. I guess for sumo you could always just trim down to 3 competitors but it would be cool to see a team of 6 stay together throughout each event. Just an idea

[sinewav]

Most DF people can 1 vs 1 without a referee anyways and be just fine as long as they both understand the rules of DF well and are honest.

The honesty factor is the greatest argument for settings and scoring that don't require a referee. In a small community like this, where commitment is sparse and bad blood is all around, making the game less dependent on the very few respected individuals we have is the best course of action if you want success.