Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

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TheDelta
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Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by TheDelta »

After a kind of disappointing first Yellow Submarine Tourney (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcIB3n_ivtQ) won my mr.
and a decent YS tourney last year (http://bsarmaclan.webs.com/apps/forums/ ... ember-21st),
it was time to organize another tournament! The third annual YS tournament played in "The classic Submarine Tournament".

Bs Clan:
At first Bs clan would organize the tournament, under the idea: 2 servers each 8vs8, top 4 continue. 4 drop off, final 1vs1.
But after a server crash of Bs, Mirage (server provider), BsTrust (referee) and me decided to put up the tournament under a different server under a little adapted system.

Problems with previous tourneys:
The biggest problem with the first two tournaments were closers and runners. Nobody dared to attack or even fight (check final of the first video, which was unbearable to witness). The second tournament dealt a little better with this, but still everyone tried to stab, close and bd (backdoor) everything. Which made why the winner of the tournament was the best runner & digger instead of most skilled player. (eg: mr. won the first tournament in the finale against Peat. mr. never played YS before and was able to win).

Original idea:
To solve this, the original idea were anti-stab settings. These settings automatically create a gap between two lines, so stabs are impossible. But this feature is known to be glitchy and not functioning how it should. Furthermore you should be able to stab to close the backdoor (for the runners) or ride close to the line to gain speed.

The system used:
The systems which we really used in tournament went as follow:
• The tournament will be played in one server, with a maximum of 12 players. Each match, the bottom two players on the scoreboard drop out of the tournament. After 5 matches played, two players will be left in a final 1vs1.
• The score limit drops as the matches proceed (first match until 30, third until 20, fifth until 14, final until 10).
• No stabbing or running on purpose, a referee (BsTrust in this case) will monitor the whole tournament and punish any excessive stabbing or running. First by warning, later by kills or kicks. Any stab that leads to a kill will lead to -2p for the stabber and +2p for the victim.

The result:
A system can look good on paper, but how it turns out is something else. In this case I was amazed on how fluent the tournament got played. Everybody fight each other, follow others and no excessive closing or running occurred. Never BsTrust had to disqualify anyone for stabbing, only a few unintentional death-stabs lead to a -2/+2p adaption.
This was certainly the best tournament out of 3 and a lot of players were enthusiast about the system.
The simple idea of 'every match 2 drop out' makes the tournament easy for everyone and fun.

What can be improved:
Since the tournament (idea) got put up in only one hour (after we found out Bs servers were down), some improvements can be made:
• More advertisement about the tourney: it seemed not everyone knew about the tournament and it was only mentioned on Bs forums and not here or in a server.
• Objective referees: BsTrust really did an awesome job as referee, but ideal would be two referees because Trust couldn't see every move of every player at any time. Of course it is not that easy to find really objective referees, but a better preparation could fix this.
• Drop outs: The two players with the lowest score dropped out, but sometimes the bottom scores were like: 6-6-2. Of course the player with only 2 points certainly drops, but there should be a way to determine the other drop out (when equal score of 6). This tourney we used the system to let them fight alone and the first death would drop of. This required all other players to go to spec, which was a little clumsy. A solution can be for example a script that makes this easier.
• Stabs: it would be even better if the referee could use a command: /stab player1 player2 when p1 gets stabbed by p2. This command will automatically take the 2 points of p2 and will respawn p1. This way, it was like the stab never happened.

Overall, it was a very nice, fluent an fun tournament! Thanks to Mirage, BsTrust and everyone who joined! Comments on how to improve this system and if/when the next tournament should take place are very welcome.

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vov
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by vov »

My reactions about this post:
Yellow Submarine Tourney
Heh why wasn't I told about it?
The biggest problem with the first two tournaments were closers and runners
Oh, that's why. :D

revx
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by revx »

I think it was organized pretty well, considering the short amount of time in which it got set up! Here are my thoughts about it:
*) At the official starting time (8pm GMT) there was no real information what the status of the tournament was - no special servers were visible, so everyone was left clueless. This is a no-go. At least update the tournament (announcement) page! There needs to be information in time if it's canceled or delayed, etc.
*) I'm fine with the bottom 2 drop out rule - but if it's to decide between two (or even three) players who to drop out, I would NOT make it "first one to die drops out" BUT instead "first one who kills advances" - this way the players are forced to be more active/aggressive instead of defensive.
*) I personally would have favoured 20pts matches for every level except the finals where I would prefer a "2 kills difference" win.
*) I like the no-stab/no-close policy and the related "punishment"/correction via the referee. But I guess one referee for 12 players is too less...
*) Btw, 12 players caused quite some lag (I think even 8 did), so matches on two servers would probably improve that.
*) I didn't know about the Christmas tournament, so I can only compare it to the very first "stabby" tournament, and clearly the recent (third) tournament was way better and more enjoyable.
*) I wouldn't mind having a tournament every 3 months (and maybe have an overall "player of the year"?!).
*) For unknown reasons I fell off the server several times(!) which normally happens maybe once a year - something strange was going on (and might be investigated); I lost valuable playing time.

The final was me vs. Delta - and Delta won. Congratulations! Well-deserved!
But to be honest, the final was the most boring part of the whole tournament, because the finalists were too defensive. There should be a concept to avoid this.
Referee Trust did a great job!!!

Thanks to all that made this tournament happen and thanks to all that participated and made it a fair game!

Word
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by Word »

revx wrote:There should be a concept to avoid this
e.g. closing, done properly.
Delta wrote:Original idea:
To solve this, the original idea were anti-stab settings. These settings automatically create a gap between two lines, so stabs are impossible. But this feature is known to be glitchy and not functioning how it should. Furthermore you should be able to stab to close the backdoor (for the runners) or ride close to the line to gain speed.
Maybe the devs can help you with that.

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[Anonymous]
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by [Anonymous] »

vov wrote:My reactions about this post:
Yellow Submarine Tourney
Heh why wasn't I told about it?
Last edited by [Anonymous] on Mon May 16, 2016 3:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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[Anonymous]
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by [Anonymous] »

Those settings are useless tbh. Been used before. Any Good Open player wouldn't complain about closers, sigh...But I forgot, this is Yellow Sub we're talking about.

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Z-Man
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by Z-Man »

Delta wrote:Original idea:
To solve this, the original idea were anti-stab settings... But this feature is known to be glitchy and not functioning how it should.
Maybe the devs can help you with that.[/quote]
Certainly. We already got the feedback that the setting possibilities do not do the job open players want, but sadly, no specifics yet.

Hmm, I don't think it would be possible for any system to distinguish reliably between closing a backdoor and general closing (though, suggestions welcome), so that seems out.

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vov
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Re: Yellow Sub Tourney! (#3)

Post by vov »

This is the move which allows a player who wants to close another to "stab" despite cycle_rubber_mindistance_gap:

Code: Select all

|^
||
||    ---
||   |   |
| ---    |
|  ------
| |
| |
|^|
|||
|||
|| ----- <- closer
||
| ------ <- follower
|
 ------- <- any other wall
The closer is allowed to go closer to the wall because of _mindistance_gap which kills the follower (unless the follower tunnels the whole R-LLLR-R, which, depending on the other rubber settings, might be close to impossible).

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