PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue - 12 Month Ladle Ban Issued

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Soul
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PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue - 12 Month Ladle Ban Issued

Post by Soul »

Since no one else has done this, I'll try my best at it.

I have sent out a PM to all team leaders/server admins with the protocol for the trial:
Vogue is accused of disobeying her Ladle 84 ban. Given the evidence provided, is Vogue guilty of breaking a Ladle rule or an offense against the tournament and community? If so, how many Ladles should they be banned for? (0 - 12)

Evidence:
compguygene wrote:I have just finished fully reviewing the recording opening_ctliv_ww_vs_spd that z-man posted. And I have asked my fellow clan members what happened, so I can share it here. Basically, none of us realized that Capone, who started this game as Shock, did not own the account [email protected] Based on the screenshots that I am going to provide you from the recording, that you can verify for yourself how Wild West was duped into this.
At the beginning of the game, Capone came in and logged in as [email protected]
At about 2120 on the recording, Capone changed his name to Vogue and logged in as [email protected]
http://i.imgur.com/klPxGR9.png
http://i.imgur.com/SIeiFAV.png

Then Liz pointed out that everyone should look at her ping. She had to use an Aussie VPN to play.
http://i.imgur.com/Mqyxg2r.png
Cadillac, one of the two Wild West Team Leaders then proceeded to kick Liz from the team and subbed in someone else to play.
http://i.imgur.com/lD6GeXr.png

I think that this clearly shows what Liz did to fool the Wild West team into allowing her to play. It also shows what Wild West did in response once they knew what was going on.
Obviously, it's pretty impossible to completely ban somebody from the Ladle, as we all already knew. But, I would imagine that it makes it a lot less fun to play through a VPN. From now on we should all be watching pings of our mates to see if they are abnormally high, and for other signs of impostering. Of course, if the imposter is determined enough, they may continue to flaunt their ability to beat the rules.
kyle wrote:Basically what compguy mentioned via screenshots is consistent with the logs on liv. The IP address used appears to be us based, but that is not always accurate.
PLAYER_RENAMED -`wwcapone [email protected] 173.245.67.241 _-`WwCapone
PLAYER_RENAMED [email protected] [email protected] 173.245.67.241 Vogue
A receipt will be sent to you after a response is given and will be posted anonymously on the trial topic.
All Team Leaders should discuss their decision with their respective team and only one response per team is needed.

If I am missing anything feel free to correct me. The voting will end a week from today (August 14th).
Last edited by Soul on Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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---------------
Notable Bans Issued:
Vogue - 12 month ban(x2)
Lucifer - 1 Day

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theo
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by theo »

Soul wrote:I have sent out a PM to all team leaders/server admins
I didn't receive any message. >_<

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Soul
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by Soul »

I was told to base it off the servers used for Ladle 84 and I didn't see yours on the brackets.

I see you signed up your servers though so I guess that qualifies you. This would mean noob13/Jip are also eligible if they so choose.

Sorry!
Chief Justice of the Armagetron Advanced Judicial System.
---------------
Notable Bans Issued:
Vogue - 12 month ban(x2)
Lucifer - 1 Day

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theo
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by theo »

I see your point.

I would have consider using the same list as the moderator list. I think it was the way it was intended to be.

But if I don't get to vote, it's not a big deal. (I still love you either way ;) )

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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by sinewav »

theo wrote:I would have consider using the same list as the moderator list. I think it was the way it was intended to be.
The current procedure follows the original plan that existed years before the Global Mod position (and list) was created. It is up to us to decide if all server owners should be involved or just ones for the specific Ladle.

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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by epsy »

Shouldn't whether WW is guilty be also judged in a PM trial?

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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by Cadillac_ »

sinewav wrote:
theo wrote:I would have consider using the same list as the moderator list. I think it was the way it was intended to be.
The current procedure follows the original plan that existed years before the Global Mod position (and list) was created. It is up to us to decide if all server owners should be involved or just ones for the specific Ladle.
I think because the vote will affect their servers, all server owners should be allowed to vote, wether or not theirs was used in ladle.
epsy wrote:Shouldn't whether WW is guilty be also judged in a PM trial?
In all fairness, I think it probably should.
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Soul
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by Soul »

I'll hold another trial for Ww after this one is finished if you all deem it fit. (Unless someone else wants to do it -- that would be nice)
Chief Justice of the Armagetron Advanced Judicial System.
---------------
Notable Bans Issued:
Vogue - 12 month ban(x2)
Lucifer - 1 Day

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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by sinewav »

Cadillac_ wrote:I think because the vote will affect their servers, all server owners should be allowed to vote, wether or not theirs was used in ladle.
Agreed. And since server owners might have information to share, like login ID's and IP addresses, they should also be forthcoming with that information. We can say something like "Given that server owners may have important login/IP information, their participation is especially important. The Global Mod list should be included in the PM trial. If a trial results in a ban, server owners should turn over any relevant data."

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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by Monkey »

epsy wrote:Shouldn't whether WW is guilty be also judged in a PM trial?
Yes.

The whole confusion about Shock/Capone/whoever nicely confirms sine's thread about why aliases suck. If people just used one name and registered that name on the arma forums, this kind of thing would happen less.

As for Liz's trial, I have informed my team mates and we should have a response in the next few days.
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delinquent
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by delinquent »

Oops. I missed this thread and may have sent my reply to the entire recipient list. Hopefully no-one read it before I caught it.

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Soul
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by Soul »

Alright here are the results:

A2A - 12 months
BB2 - 12 months
C2C - 12 months
F5F - 12 months
S16 - 12 months
Y69 - 12 months
D14 - 6 months
N41 - 6 months
H73 - 6 months
G34 - 4 months
K35 - 4 months

Voters (No correlation to the order above):
Comguygene
Gazelle
Ogo
Wap
Overrated
Takburger
Lowkey
Blondie
delinquent
kyle
Venijn

Please double check that I have your vote up there and that it is accurate. I believe the median of the results would be a 12 month ladle ban.
http://www.ramsrule.com/herd/addon.php? ... e-judy.jpg
Last edited by Soul on Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Chief Justice of the Armagetron Advanced Judicial System.
---------------
Notable Bans Issued:
Vogue - 12 month ban(x2)
Lucifer - 1 Day

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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by Cadillac_ »

While I know that no matter what I say here, it won't change the result, I think that there should be an addition to the voting format rules.

Proposal:
in the ladle voting section, there should be added a certain time that the votes have to be in by, because if voting ends on the 14th, this could be interpreted different ways.

I checked the forums (including this topic) saw that the results weren't posted, so i went to my PM's to send in Ww's vote. Then i returned to what i had been doing earlier.
The message i sent is time stamped '1:37'.
A few minutes later i got back on the forums, to find a message from soul
err i just posted the results lol
The message on the forums is time stamped 1:36 so, yes, I was technically late, but there is no specified time votes are to be in by.

Ww's Vote would have changed the results for Vogue's ban, but cant be taken into account now that the vote is done.
1. Our vote would not be private (even though you can get an idea now)
2. The ban length has already been stated.
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theo
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by theo »

Soul wrote:I believe the median of the results would be a 12 month ladle ban.
indeed

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kyle
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Re: PM Trial Ladle 84 Re: Vogue

Post by kyle »

one thing you are missing is the list of who actually voted
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