Ladle 79

[Titanoboa]

Before be a Fortress player Elmo was a Tronner first and we are having a big Tron tournament in 2 days. Why wait till ladle?

Two reasons I can think of right now:
1.He was involved in the ladle more than any other tournament
2.The players that knew him are mostly ladle players. Not everyone of them might be playing CTWF and maybe a few current CTWF'ers didn't really know Elmo. Ladle makes more sense.

[orion]

Before be a Fortress player Elmo was a Tronner first and we are having a big Tron tournament in 2 days. Why wait till ladle?

Two reasons I can think of right now:
1.He was involved in the ladle more than any other tournament
2.The players that knew him are mostly ladle players. Not everyone of them might be playing CTWF and maybe a few current CTWF'ers didn't really know Elmo. Ladle makes more sense.

Yea okey, I meant, if i was his friend (i think he has got friends on this game) i wouldnt wait till ladle for honoring him, thats all

[Vogue]

Um... dedicating bowl to him isn't a one time event, orion. And ya, what the tit said.

[sinewav]

Let's not worry about this too much. If any teams want to salute (it's such a cool idea) then let them decide at that time. For those who believe such things I'm sure Andrew would be touched to see at least this much recognition.

[pike]

I really like the salute idea, except for the last part, so I was thinking - after both teams pass each other they will go through opponents zones - it will be like double torp, both zones will collapse almost instantly and the round will end soon after. So maybe when both sets of players reach the zone, they should simply turn? Position 1,3,5 turns right, 2,4,6 left, the round will end before anyone reaches side rim wall.

The other thing (up for discussion probably) is naming Bowl with Elmo's real name - I don't really like this part, most of us didn't really knew Elmo well enough, so to use his last name freely for tron competition is unnecessary. ElmosBowl is a good enough name IMO.

[sinewav]

I really like the salute idea, except for the last part, so I was thinking...

What you are describing happen repeatedly in warm-up rounds anyway. The idea behind the salute is a moment of silence and reflection, something you can't have if players are thinking about a zone.

ElmosBowl is a good enough name IMO.

A real human being died, not a avatar. I did make a bold decision to rename the Bowl and I'm sorry I didn't check with the community. I feel a special attachment with both the Bowl and Elmo since (1) I do all the prep-work for Bowl and (2) Elmo had become one of my favorite players and he was a tremendous help to me over the past two years.

We can open it to discussion if you like.

[Titanoboa]

The Magargle Bowl is a perfect name. We could vote, for the sake of it, I really don't think it's a necessity though. In most cases it would be bad to just go ahead and make changes, as you know that I know that you know (etc), but this is fine imo.

[J Dawg]

The Magargle Bowl is a perfect name. We could vote, for the sake of it, I really don't think it's a necessity though. In most cases it would be bad to just go ahead and make changes, as you know that I know that you know (etc), but this is fine imo.

I agree. The Magargle bowl would be very fitting. I also think the driving into a wall and not turning is a good idea also, but we should leave it to the player whether or not they want to add "E" or for example: J-World. As some said, it should not be forced, and some players did not know elmo well, others did. Everyone should be able to not touch there keyboard and drive straight.

[pike]

A real human being died, not a avatar.

To this community Andrew was Elmo and it didn't make him less human, you missed my point. I doubt many of us knew his last name before, and I may be alone in this opinion here, but I feel we're violating his family's privacy in some way. This community is just too virtual and anonymous and we just weren't close enough to him to have the right to use his real name. We learned about his death full month after it happened - that's saying something for me.

But that's just my opinion and I don't think we should have any more discussion about it, if you feel you've done right thing, then let's leave it as it is.

And the vote is probably the worst idea to decide this, so let's not mention it again.

What you are describing happen repeatedly in warm-up rounds anyway. The idea behind the salute is a moment of silence and reflection, something you can't have if players are thinking about a zone.

Ok, maybe I'm overthinking it.

[sinewav]

...I may be alone in this opinion here, but I feel we're violating his family's privacy in some way. This community is just too virtual and anonymous and we just weren't close enough to him to have the right to use his real name. We learned about his death full month after it happened - that's saying something for me.

Andrew's father commented on Tron Times that "[he liked] the idea of the tournament honoring Andrew as people remembering him is a big help now." I do understand your concern about privacy and would immediately remove his name if I didn't already have approval. I'll make a point to contact his family and confirm this.

Yes, we did not find out about his passing until weeks after, but we were also not expecting to hear from him. The last time KS talked to Elmo said he would be busy graduating and moving across the country to start a job. We did not expect to hear from him for weeks, or even at all, because that sometimes happens when people enter a new phase in life. We were all excited for him, wished him good luck and hoped he would have time to return to the game. We anticipated his absence, not his death. But how close we were on a personal level does not change his value to the game or reduce the honors he is entitled to, IMO.

[bilbo baggins]

just a reminder that ladle is this Sunday, unfortunately Elmo isn't with us anymore so there has not been a topic bump yet, get your teamed signed up asap! the brackets are looking slim.

[Vogue]

wow pike........

[pike]

Yes, Vogue?


Sinewav: thanks for clarifying few things I wasn't aware of - but I still think that certain parties (including me) needn't know some information. Just because internet media make them available for me doesn't mean they are right in doing so. Elmo's father said on TT that "The news reports online are accurate. So, we know how it happened in far more detail than we would want". Just because that's the way media works, doesn't mean I have to blindly accept it.

I fully understand if you (and Vogue) reacted very emotional on news of Elmo's death, but I've seen enough of internet to know that some people can react in a very bad way in delicate situations like this. It's not only about today's sumo-fort community, new people come and join every day, so things like that should be done with more thought than personal feeling.

But how close we were on a personal level does not change his value to the game or reduce the honors he is entitled to, IMO.

That's for sure, I'm not and never was against honoring Elmo's involvement in tron community at all, I just want to point that things like memorials are done in certain way, there are do's and do-nots for a reason. For instance naming Bowl only after his last name make it very impersonal IMO, things like that ALWAYS use first and last name, unless it concerns a number of people. If the community insists on honouring Elmo this way, I'd advise you to name it Andrew M-- Bowl.

[sinewav]

For instance...

Just so you know I take your concerns seriously I went ahead and contacted Andrew's father to ask how he felt about using his surname. He doesn't mind at all and appreciates the sentiment, being completely indifferent to the use of his family name or a screen name. It is really up to us to decide. And since I don't want anyone to feel uncomfortable I'm totally up for changing it to The Elmo Bowl, Andrew's Bowl, or whatever feels best. I used his last name mostly because I thought it rolled off the tongue nicely. But really, we can call it anything we want.

I'm open to suggestions, so fire away.

[kite]

if any teams need a sub pm me or contact me on IRC.