Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

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owned
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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by owned »

The problem I see with that is that now, if a zone is small, especially when there are two people left, the players will risk a lot to stay in. If you add the stay alive points, players might opt to risk less and value surviving more than getting the zone at the end. Which I think is a problem.

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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by Overrated »

Why mess with something that's been working just fine? Can you say you've been having unreliable results? There's already enough parody (with the best players still at the top and winning while there are newer faces in the finals as well competing), so you're going to reward the better survivors even more now than they already get for just being good?

If you want to change anything, add a rule for no suicides on another person's wall to get someone out of the tournament (I've seen it utilized to push a player into the top 4, and another out on separate occasions), not something that will just make people play a lot more cautious than they already do.
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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by reversi »

I believe the tournament is good the way it is, and if you were planning on having a championship one soon, then why change the settings just before it, meaning all currently seeded players might not find it the tournament they like anymore.

However, I would like to see maybe a one-off single-bind varient of the tournament, even if it is for fun.

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0000
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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by 0000 »

When talking about making wholesale changes to a game, there should always be much care in doing so. Hundreds of players have spent hundreds of hours in an attempt to learn and perfect strategies that are optimized for the current scoring system.

Of the two big changes being discussed:

a. Changing the score to put a bigger value on kills and less on surviving. The aggressive players obviously want this. Their style is more difficult to pull off as the skill in a zone increases. But it doesn't seem that the majority of players want this to happen.

b. Adding a score survival scheme, suggested by cody.

Cody can you be more specific with exactly what you are trying to accomplish? This is a pretty big deal, so we need compelling reasons why the new way will make the game better.
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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by Cody »

Sumo Scoring has always been questioned since day one.

Look at the old 1v1 Sumo Scoring system, it was 10 rounds and limit 600 points, this caused for some interesting results but also some unfair results in my opinion.

Then I came in and made it first to 600 and unlimited rounds which actually had a very positive result, it caused for some of the best comebacks in sumo history(liz vs wap in the 1v164 , wap was like 540 and liz had 90, she ended up coming back and winning 600-540) in the old 1v1 Sumo Scoring system, a player wasn't even able to make a decent comeback, and if they tried, the other player could just drive outside the zone til round 10.(also happened to liz, she was vs xyron, she was able to make a comeback, but xyron drove outside the zone, giving her only 60 pts, round ended and xyron won 30points ahead of her)

SCORE_KILL & FORTRESS_CONQUERED_SCORE has always been a concern of mine and plenty of otheres(i remember servers just offering kill points and no zone points or vice versa).

Right now in sumo its more beneficial to camp than to be aggressive
(total zone points in sumo bar is 8+10+12+15+20+30+60=155 total points for just staying in the zone)
that's 5 points more than dumping 5 tronners. Why would you risk dying to dump 62% of the circle, for you can dump 1-2 tronners(30-90pts) and get 155 points at the end of the round.

So question is where do we meet with scoring? so if you wanna camp thats cool, but if u wanna be aggressive, thats cool too and maybe u should get a reward for being aggressive, but u should get a reward for camping as well. How do we incorporate both of these skills without upsetting the balance, because of right now in SBT it may seemed balanced but the fact is, its more beneficial to just camp than to go kill someone cause everyone knows, it only takes about 1.2k+ to get into the top 4 and move on.

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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by Cronix »

I hope I am not fully mistaken here, but isn't the reward for an aggressive player an extra 30 points to the points he already gets for staying in the zone?

I think the risk reward balance is okay right now and should really not be changed.

Given the fact that one camps and wins the round with killing noone. (you have to make that happen first... its harder than it sounds) He gets 155 points... well 185 points regarding the fact that he might kill the last one.

Now lets give the aggressive players some points. He dies last. So he gets 95 points. So even if he "only" kills 2 players he is even with the camper in the case he drives out of the zone at the end of space for him. If he kills more he is even ahead of the camper. And killing 3 out of 6 is not that hard, since you are the aggressive player.

The balance out of being aggressive and knowing when-to and especially knowing how-to camp is, in my opinion, the perfection of a sumo player.
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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by Titanoboa »

I think the winner of the Sumo Bar Tournament should be the best Sumo Bar player, hence I think the settings should be similar to the public Sumo Bar servers. Adding a score_survive would just make it differ from public play which in a way decreases the relevance of the whole tournament.

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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by DaGarBBaGeMAN »

Agreed with vov. I appreciate it when people take the riskier strategy in sumo by going for kills, instead of camping it out. No need for change!
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Re: Sumo Bar Tournament Possible New Settings feedback

Post by 1200 »

Clutch wrote:I vote you only get votes for killing people
This would be an interesting setting that would make it a totally different game that would require totally different strategies from what it is. Would be interesting to try it but that shouldn't be the same tourny.
Cody wrote:And what this does is reward the player who is alive at the very end of the round, so surviving to the very last will now be even MORE rewarding. Of course we would have to agree what amount of points should be awarded.
I don't see a problem with the scoring system that is in place now. I think you are just playing around with the idea of having different settings to change up (spice up?) the game but I think like 0000 said they should come with compelling reasons for doing it.
Cody wrote:Right now in sumo its more beneficial to camp than to be aggressive
I don't know if I agree with you on this. An aggressive player who can survive till the end can score much more than a non-aggressive camper who doesn't get any kills.
Also when a match is close near the end it favors the aggressive players because they are more likely to get a core dump and be able to win it.
I think 30 pts is a decent reward for getting a core dump considering some of the dumps are result of suicides or accidental kills as well.
Titty wrote:"I think the winner of the Sumo Bar Tournament should be the best Sumo Bar player, hence I think the settings should be similar to the public Sumo Bar servers. Adding a score_survive would just make it differ from public play which in a way decreases the relevance of the whole tournament."
I agree it seems to make more sense to have the same settings as the servers people are playing and practicing regularly.

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