CTF BRAWL 18 [ Brackets posted ]

[Tru]

BRACKETS ARE POSTED

Authorities file for server admins is ready! (we need 4 servers)

[Slickster]

ooo R has a nys lineup o.o

[PokeMaster]

More like forx just did a "K I SIGN UP EVERY1 I CAN THINK OF." It'll all work out though. Hopefully..

[compguygene]

You now have 4 servers, 2 from RX, 2 from ID.

[Venijn]

You now have 4 servers, 2 from RX, 2 from ID.

Make that eight.

[Wind]

Thanks to the admins for helping run the event (Been 1.5 years of brawl already!? )
Animuson
Titanboa
Weed
Tru
Also thanks to the server hosts Comp and Rx.
I had some very fun and intense matches, hope you did too!
See you all at brawl 19!

[tomb]

TBH the rules need changing 4v4 is just too predictable an outcome. Players cannot take risks in a 4v4=> inexperienced teams will never win.

Needs to be 5v5.

[sinewav]

Players take plenty of risks -- and sometimes win big. Even 5v5 will eventually fall into "predictable" patterns. Why should inexperienced teams have a chance against well-seasoned ones? We have a wiki page explaining the basics of CTF for the noob-teams. It's up to them to learn how to play, then play well and win.

If you don't put in the time, don't expect it to be easy. You went from one team that barely practiced (PRU) to another (ID). Get your guys into numerous serious matches going on during the weeknights and get better.

[tomb]

Even 5v5 will eventually fall into "predictable" patterns.

I agree to a point.. but the extra player would give more strategic options to teams rather than follow the standard 2 def 2 atk model.
.. it would get more players involved & the games would be more exiting. Once you've lost 2 players it can be almost impossible to recover against a well oiled team.
For me its all about getting more people involved. With the current situation is you may as well cut out the quarter finals straight to the semis/finals.

[Agent007]

Gms R and Gz ~U. I was surprised we took a match against R with only 3 . See you all next brawl

[sinewav]

...but the extra player would give more strategic options to teams rather than follow the standard 2 def 2 atk model.
.. it would get more players involved & the games would be more exiting. Once you've lost 2 players it can be almost impossible to recover against a well oiled team.
For me its all about getting more people involved. With the current situation is you may as well cut out the quarter finals straight to the semis/finals.

I've always been an advocate of the 5v5 model (see here and here), so I'm totally behind you on that. But even as 5v5, the game would fall into a formula after a time. It's just how CTF is.

I would like to see more players too, but as you know, it's hard to even get 4 people to show up, let alone 5. This Brawl saw BrawlerzZ with only 3 players, TBD had to get a sub, and so did gArIsImO's open team.

Of course, the main reason why CTF tournaments aren't as fun as they could be is because almost no one plays CTF seriously except foir Untitled, and they have, like, enough people for 3 teams. It would be better is the talent was more diffuse like in Fortress, but I guess that takes time. Ladle talent didn't start getting diffuse until it was well into the 20's.

Just keep at it tomb. With lil' b on the team you guys should be able to make a lot of progress, very quickly if you can get the rest of your team committed.

[Tobe]

If you don't put in the time, don't expect it to be easy.... Get your guys into numerous serious matches going on during the weeknights and get better.

Well said and I agree. There have been almost daily matches going on during US weeknights for the past two weeks leading up to brawl, where the most competitive players/teams have been getting ready for this. One, or his/her teammates, cannot expect to practice a day or two before brawl and be on par with the other more active participants. Also, the "srs matches" we have are much more intense preparation for Brawl than one can expect to get from the casual Wild West CTF server.

Even 5v5 will eventually fall into "predictable" patterns.

I agree to a point.. but the extra player would give more strategic options to teams rather than follow the standard 2 def 2 atk model.
.. it would get more players involved & the games would be more exiting. Once you've lost 2 players it can be almost impossible to recover against a well oiled team.
For me its all about getting more people involved. With the current situation is you may as well cut out the quarter finals straight to the semis/finals.

Back in the early days of Ww-hosted tourneys, it used to be 5v5, but there were many reasons why that was discontinued.

The first and main reason was that 5v5 was extremely laggy, especially with the teams with players that can do crazy fast multibinds. The grid would also become very crowded when all the players were alive. It was actually just clunky play. If I remember correctly Levi wrote something about this (when discussing the benefits of a 4v4) on the lagtest forums.

Secondly, although this is mainly my opinion, the 5v5 did not open up strategies for weaker teams (as they would just use the fifth man as a "resser"). Besides, strong teams have strong subs and weak teams have weaker subs. How is adding another player going to reduce the gap?

Lastly, it can be attributed to the fact that many teams had only 3 or 4 players show up anyway (especially the teams that were not clan-based).

[tomb]

The first and main reason was that 5v5 was extremely laggy, especially with the teams with players that can do crazy fast multibinds.

The internet worldwide has sped up a lot since then + server technology continues to improve => it shouldn't be as laggy.

Besides, strong teams have strong subs and weak teams have weaker subs. How is adding another player going to reduce the gap?

If you look at the wiki the open teams do have strong individual players but of course never play together so you can expect them not to win. But the consequence of just 1 player dying in my opinion is just too great. Adding an extra player would open the field up a little I think. The stronger teams atm are all relying on the same strategy's and frankly the game is stagnant. I maybe wrong but I think its because there are only 4 players. The 5th would give you another option to do something else ...there is so much more 1 player can contribute more than simply respawning their team.

Ok I'm not putting my argument across very well :S

Though I do agree there would be a problem getting 5 players in a team.

Well just thought it might be worth further investigation.

[sinewav]

The internet worldwide has sped up a lot since then + server technology continues to improve => it shouldn't be as laggy.

Speed is irrelevant. Armagetron hardly uses any bandwidth at all. What you need is stability. Unfortunately, that's what is getting harder and harder to find as the Internet grows and more devices and users need to share. I have >90% packet loss from my ISP, surely because their routers are working overtime trying to accommodate hundreds, maybe thousands of new connections daily. But my connection is way, way faster than Armagetron needs.

I do wish it could be 5v5 because CTF is surprisingly complex at times and there are many "points of interest" on the grid. Four points, compared to two in Fortress where the teams are larger. Might reduce some stalemates, maybe...

[Word]

make it 6v6 and stretch the arena, so you have more room for 1v1 battles.

OR

make the arena smaller (so the zones are closer together) and keep it 4v4, then matches will look much faster.