Fort players looking for a home

For things that have to do with those crazy test servers... and yeah. By request of z-man, and, of course, you gotta obey...

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Whats you favourite fortress server?

Legit's Regular Fortress
1
4%
Wild West - Fortress
2
9%
2020 team challenge
12
52%
LoD - Tron World Cup Server
1
4%
AST Server - Fortress
1
4%
LoD - Fortress Server
4
17%
Dubki.Ru - Fortress Server
0
No votes
°°ps arena
0
No votes
...other...
2
9%
 
Total votes: 23

Luke-Jr
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Post by Luke-Jr »

wrtlprnft wrote:Sad as it is, I don't see anyone in the same position:
I'm currently running groundpig's CTF config on my advertisement server (which I can only barely afford to justify running because it is on the Europe host which has plenty of resources available and because it advertises).
If anyone (or better yet, a group of someones) wants hosting for development or debugging purposes, contact me and I'll see if I can work out a discount of some sort.
wrtlprnft wrote:Luke-Jr has a good server, but limited time on his hand. He probably knows a thing or two about the engine as he invented hexatron. The problem there is that he has limited time and tends to only do something if it offers a prospect of earning money with it.
Hey, I have bills to pay, and need to make a living. ;)
I am planning to finally start working on XMPP integration tonight, though.
wrtlprnft wrote:I think the way to go here might be some sort of group effort. Someone hosts a server, maybe accepting donations for keeping it running, and interested people get accounts on it. These would have to agree to some guidelines as not sharing IPs or harming the server and would get access to the BUG cries and the recordings accociated with it. Maybe even automatically publish the logs directly around BUG cries for everyone (IPs stripped) so that everyone can read them.
I could certainly host it if someone wants to help me pay the expenses, or if there's enough donations to do so-- if 2020 wants to use his server for it, that works as well.
For accessing logs/recordings, I'd rather push them out to hachi where people can download it locally to examine/work on it instead of making local accounts on the server itself.
2020 wrote:feel free to use team challenge
Rain wrote:Last, if 2020 payed that server, how can we give back him money for that?
If this ends up happening, I'd be glad to see about giving 2020 a discounted rate. As far as donations, if it's wanted, I could arrange PayPal or Google Checkout button(s) to send directly to me associated with his account so as to avoid doubling the PayPal fees.
DDMJ wrote:
wrtlprnft wrote:[*]Luke-Jr has a good server,
Woah not true! At least for his servers in America. 2 days ago I was in the server with someone else and all of a sudden we paused, then it our cycles were like floating up and up then the arena got really small and then a HUGE crash and then we tiimed out.
Never heard a word of this happened, on any server. I did notice a routing problem when I tried to do a backup yesterday, though, but it was fixed before I could file a report.
I'm aware Legit's server had some lag problems earlier on due to his removing the DEDICATED_IDLE 1 configuration that was necessary to block memory leaks.
DDMJ wrote:He assured Legit that it was a good server and that was the one where I was "flying" in.
Sorry if you're having problems, but the few times someone's mentioned it to me, I went there and everything was fine (short the configuration issue).
DDMJ wrote:This is probably our best bet although you can't get recordings.
Sure you can, provided you enable recording (which isn't supported by the web admin interface, but is certainly something I can enable)

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Rain
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Post by Rain »

Durka: we met here to find a solution. You know doesnt exist a server that gives all players a good ping. CVS server wasnt a perfect server, just a respected server. lag-bug-lies-slide: that is what I ear all the time I play in servers. Means nothing. It is a part of the game.
Now, if you have some different suggestions you are welcome, but please people, dont start to mess around if you are not interested.

About this problem of pings Im starting a poll, lets see what is the favourite server.

Luke-Jr
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Post by Luke-Jr »

Rain wrote:About this problem of pings Im starting a poll, lets see what is the favourite server.
Pings aren't highly relevant to the testing aspect, and the original Bugfarm was in Europe, so I'd definately give my vote to a Europe host (despite being in the US myself). Also, I'm probably more capable of giving a discount on the Europe host than on the US one.

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Rain
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Post by Rain »

Good. So Luke, we need your help. 2020 offered to pay, but Im still in doubt about that. Do you think the 2020 team challenge is the better fortress server you can host?
If not what about the costs of a better server?
Are you offering your help in technical things too?
Will you analize, with someone else, bug cries?
Will you help developers improving this wonderful game?

Take the bible and answer.

LOL!

Luke-Jr
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Post by Luke-Jr »

Rain wrote:Good. So Luke, we need your help. 2020 offered to pay, but Im still in doubt about that. Do you think the 2020 team challenge is the better fortress server you can host?
The configuration is 2020's control, so changes to it would need to be done through him (or him giving his remote or web admin passwords to people). Personally, I don't like fortress (or any game mode where I need to wait for the next round after I die).
Rain wrote:If not what about the costs of a better server?
http://levopede.dashjr.org -- the next upgrade would be 32-slot, for $32/mo (before debug/develop discount, which I would need to determine based on my exact costs and such)
Rain wrote:Are you offering your help in technical things too?
Will you analize, with someone else, bug cries?
Bug tracking isn't fun, and I'm very short on time these days.
Rain wrote:Will you help developers improving this wonderful game?
When I do get time to develop, it will be primarily on XMPP and vValue stuff.

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Lackadaisical
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Post by Lackadaisical »

Do bugs happen all that often anyway? I'ts been a long while since i've had a 'BUG!'-moment. IIRC most bugs were because z-man was improving and experimenting with the code.

Has anyone played large matches on 2020s server? how was it?

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Rain
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Post by Rain »

Has anyone played large matches on 2020s server? how was it?
Was like bugfarm was in same conditions.

As I said, there's no perfect server.
Im just trying to move things without zman.

Luke: maybe we should find someone who hosts a server personally.
Costs are too high.

Lack, do you have any better idea instead of use 2020's server?

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Z-Man
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Post by Z-Man »

Luke-Jr wrote:I am planning to finally start working on XMPP integration tonight, though.
Ohh, ooh! I forgot to tell everybody possibly working on authentication that the method to mark an eNetPlayer as authenticated should be:
- set the authenticated flag (disable the ingame admin for now, it should be username based once auth is working anway)
- set the userName_ string to
"<authMethod>:<authority>:<username>"
- make it so that if the authenticated flag is set, userName_ is left unchanged by ePlayerNetID::UpdateName(), otherwise a name change will destroy the authentication status
More cleanup work to do, but that can wait:
- give unauthenticated players the userName_ "::<player name stripped of unwanted stuff>", all that is required is to add the "::", the stripping is already done.
- adapt the highscore loading to add the extra "::" to all names if a list without the :: convention is loaded
- get the information which player is authenticated how to the players, probably by extending the /players command
- the name resolving thing

I think the :: coding is optimal; it only bans the : from the authMethod and authority parts (@ would be a valid alternative, I don't care enough to start a fight), no special character needs to be forbidden in the username. Of course, the authentication method will have its own limitations, I bet xmms forbids @ and such.
The reasons for the complication:
a) XMMS is not fully optimal, players can be tracked
b) GGZ comes with a builtin authentication mechanism (where also, the GGZ server can track players, so it's not optimal either). GGZ users should be able to use that directly should we add GGZ suport. Similar things may apply to other metagame browsers.
Both mean that we need to stay open to other protocols.

End of thread hijacking.
DDMJ wrote:Bugfarm discouraged "noobs" to come to the servers. It had several messages to tell these "noobs" to go practice in other servers.
Dead wrong. Only the server description in the browser was a bit into that direction, hinting "new players" to have a go at sumo first. But that doesn't teach you the fortress setup, right? So even those who listened to that and got a practice round or two would be accused of noobdom by the self proclaimed pros once they returned to fortress. I never wanted that, and did not have enough time to administer the server to teach you all proper manners. That's the reason the server is down, and the reason why I did not answer the two PMs (and sasha's post) I got offering me accounts on probably really good servers (thanks guys!!!). I needed to make my mind up about the whole bugfarm thing, and I think I'm done. Sorry, I won't run a player ruled fortress server again. Possibly, if I think there could be enough ingame admins (no problem if the server can't destroy anyone's PHD thesis) to keep the server friendly to newcomers most of the time, I'll reconsider.
Of course, expect other test servers to pop up every once in a while. Just not a plain old fortress one.

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Rain
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Post by Rain »

Thanks zman for your enlightment.

About kicking newbies:

True, when I started to play arma on internet there was CVS test server. I remember the first time, with my nick "woodrow" I joined the server and got kicked before understand what was happening.
Then I went in ds arena, started to play there and only after some weeks I retried with fortress. LOL!

Yesterday I was talking with Plato about the TWC. We wanted to get Ciccio in our italian team, but he was worried about his skills.
I think Plato, joking about that, defined perfectly the difference from a noob that gives problem to a team and a noob that doesnt.
He said: "basta che sa grindare e girare a destra poi può anche morire"
Translated: "just he knows to grind and split, then he can die"
Hehehe! I cant stop to laugh...

Well, how to solve that?

Should we make a fortress training server?

Soon the °°ps arena will get some maps that Im making with the target of improve fortress skills, but that was thought for "pros".

Should I make a server for noobs in °°ps arena?

(not joking, I agree with that)

I think after one hour playing a newbie is already able to grind and split.
But players must help.

Anyways, somewhere in a server I noticed that polls for kick was setted for one round to vote. That makes people kicked only when very necessary, in my opinion.

Go on in this way. I think we are finding a way.

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wrtlprnft
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Post by wrtlprnft »

Getting newbies (don't like the term “noob”) to learn how to play needs effort by all players or at least the majority of them.
Instead of crying “OMG noob grind or kick” (the newbie most likely doesn't know what grinding is, nor does he know about the poll system), or issuing a kick poll right after the first round, people would need to cooperate:
  • The change that there's gonna be a newbie on your team is about as high as having a newbie on the other team (well, they tend to join the team that's already losing as a server default, but that's negible IMHO). Don't blame the newbie for your suckage. Deal with it and try to avoid getting killed, the newbie might figure out what everyone else does eventually.
  • If the newbie doesn't get it, try to explain what he/she's supposed to do. Talk to him using his/her name, and tell them to try to do what everyone else does. Avoid the term grinding, as newbies probably don't know what it means and just get more confused. If they die on split, give hints there, too. If he/she constantly dies grinding he/she will soon stop doing that as he/she probably wants to play the game.
  • Use kick polls only as last measure. If you poll a newbie right away you put everyone in a dilemma: Either kick the newbie, even though he/she might learn if not kicked, or reject the poll with the risk of not being able to kick him/her of he/she doesn't learn at all or turns out to be a jerk.
  • Don't blindly accept kick polls. Sometimes I get kickpolled by someone for no apparent reason, and there's a shocking amount of people accepting the poll, even though I don't teamkill and (hopefully) aren't a total jerk.
There's no place like ::1

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Lucifer
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Post by Lucifer »

Also, the more players that actively oppose kick polls that are used as a replacement for communication the better off we'll all be. So even if the kick poll is "correct" (i.e. the target really isn't grinding and stuff), the person who put up the poll needs to have already tried to talk to the targeted player, and it needs to be more than just a token "grind or tell us what your problem is, noob!".
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DDMJ
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Post by DDMJ »

lol too many posts to read. Ok...Luke I made a video of me and someone else playing in Legit's server (while dedicated_idle was set to 1) and there were crazy lag spikes. Ok enough with the dogging of servers. @Z-man: Well, I counted the auto_team 0 as another way to deal with new players. I think the 2020 team challenge server is our best shot. I don't think it would be right to bother Ady with his servers because they are for LoD clan. The upside of that though would be having a sumo server also. My vote goes for 2020 team even though I'm in America :P

Luke-Jr
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Post by Luke-Jr »

Rain wrote:Luke: maybe we should find someone who hosts a server personally.
Costs are too high.
Like I said, I can possibly do a bit of discounting/self-donating for a debugging/development server. But to get nice low pings (not to mention legal contracts/terms of service), it needs a business-class internet connection. And that sort of thing costs money, so there's always going to be some cost associated with it, even if I at some point can afford to foot the entire bill.
DDMJ wrote:Ok...Luke I made a video of me and someone else playing in Legit's server (while dedicated_idle was set to 1) and there were crazy lag spikes.
Yeah, and where is this video? How about a debugging recording which would be a bit more useful?

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2020
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Post by 2020 »

whenever a kick vote appears
i reject

i have only had to approve a couple of kicks in the 10months been playing this game
for pimp i think
and had to once or twice with ladle games
since we tried to explain to visiting players it was a comp
and for speed we just kicked
which should probably be left to admin maybe


business connection
eh?

how much does that cost?
because
rather than each of us spending money on individual servers
we could contribute to a single
kick-ass
low ping
no lag spike
fortress server
hold the line

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wrtlprnft
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Post by wrtlprnft »

According to Luke-Jr his servers are
2020 wrote:kick-ass
low ping
no lag spike
fortress servers
There's no place like ::1

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