Sumo Bar with stats

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orion
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by orion » Sat Nov 01, 2014 5:45 pm

orion wrote:sup, im having problems to get into your server, apparently cant download AAteam map (pig2)
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Magi
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by Magi » Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:48 pm

blondie wrote:
So I thought of something. While everyone is talking about how tron is dying and what ways we should try to get new people into the game, I don't think making a server where the only way you can play is in a team that most new players wouldn't know how to do or want to take the time to learn it when they can go to a server where they're guaranteed to play alone and with high rubber. This just doesn't seem like a good server idea for right now. Just my opinion though.
is this what you tell everyone running fort servers?

maybe we shouldn't have ladle, guys. you know, because noobs won't know how to sign up on the wiki.
Tournaments are a different story, but making another exclusive server that people have to sign up to play in? Weren't you just talking about how we should get rid of pickup because it takes too long to set games up and you'll have people idly waiting in irc or spectator to play? This doesn't seem much different than that. A new person will come in the server and ask how to play, and even if they figure out how to sign up and get an account to play, if there's more than 8 people in the server likelihood is they'll get bounced to spectator almost immediately. I'm not saying it's a bad server, I just don't think it's a good server for getting the sumo/fort community back on track.
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blondie
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by blondie » Sun Nov 02, 2014 12:01 am

how are tournaments different again?

or fortress for that matter? you have to know how to grind to play.

why aren't you also whining to all the hosts who leave their tourney servers up, which require auth while being vanilla sumobar/tst/fort?

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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by Magi » Sun Nov 02, 2014 12:34 am

A tournament like Ladle happens once a month, and is the most anticipated event of that month. When people see 30 people in one server, odds are they'll come in and ask how to play, I would hope some of those people in spectator would tell them how to play and how to sign up. Whereas a sumo server that could be populated some days and not other days with maybe 4 people or maybe 12 won't always have people kind enough to explain how to join. Which again is the fault of our community. If we're going to start populating servers that require a specific GID that is different from the main forums and only has one or two posts that tell you how even sign up, I somehow think that will deter new players from wanting to play sumo. Even as of now, your post was made a half a month ago and has 20 people signed up. That's far less than any sumo tournament or tournament in general generates for interest.

We could complain about server hosts leaving a server for tournament that requires GID to play, but how often do you see people in those servers when it isn't the tournament? Most of us will go to a public fort server or a public sumo server to play. Most of the time people want to use a Ladle server or a WST server it's when they want to war, which they should be allowed to do, so I don't see the problem with leaving a server up that doesn't get much use outside of its tournament day. When someone wants to fort or sumo they go to Empha's, Sumo Dive, Megafort lagless, Kyle's Nyc, dbd fortress. As far as I know those servers don't require a GID to play.

I think learning how to grind and actually playing the game would be more fun to someone than having to learn how to sign up on forums and digging through different posts just to gain access to a server that they may get spectated for being in the lower part of the points and be confused as to why they can't play or why they're not playing anymore. You know one of the main reasons why new players don't play fort? It's intimidating. The moment they actually get on a team, as soon as they do something wrong they have tons of competitive people flaming at them for doing something wrong. We need to fix our public fort game before we go adding a sumobar that tracks stats.
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by blondie » Sun Nov 02, 2014 12:54 am

"we" didn't add anything. I did. If you want to pay for part of the server hosting, I'll welcome your input into what the server runs.

this criticism coming from someone who once played 24 straight hours of casual sumobar, it makes sense that you to not have any notion of the quality difference between competition and casual play. GIDs are used to enable a lot of added value in this server. Maybe the reason so many people who quit this game is because in between tournaments there's no games worth playing. You're an idiot if you think you can solve systemic problems by just sitting in casual servers for a month and getting a bunch of noobs to start playing.

sorry for trying

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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by Magi » Sun Nov 02, 2014 1:33 am

or maybe the reason they quit is because they're no longer 13 and have jobs and school to attend to and don't want to play this game anymore. Why try and focus so much on the older players that aren't playing anymore rather than the people that are actually playing. I'm sorry that I enjoy playing this game at a casual and competitive level more than you, sorry I don't rage at my teammates and leave a server when they lose. If you rather attack me than actually defend your reasoning behind creating a server like this and try to enlighten me on why you think it's a good idea, then I'm not going to bother. Go ahead, keep hosting servers to get your old players back.
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blondie
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by blondie » Sun Nov 02, 2014 2:24 am

waaah waaah waah. that's all I hear

1

you can't criticize me for not explaining myself if you do not first ask for an explanation. you come and start whining about my server, then two days later ask for an explanation of it. don't attack things you don't understand and especially don't attack things you don't understand because you refuse to seek out an explanation for them.

2

this post is in the "test servers" section. I'm not asking you to do anything. I'm not telling you to do anything. I'm not promoting anything. I'm just sharing the existence of a test server, by its nature, still in development. you, unsurprisingly, have no notion of what a test server is. it's pretty pathetic you think a test server is worthy of your vitriol.


3

it's not about getting old players back, it's about keeping the next set of old players. developing a type of server that can run pickup without an irc bot, that can track stats, that can be used for matchmaking: this isn't done overnight. it's a proof of concept. It's about building an infrastructure so that when a new player opens the master client for the first time, there is a track that leads them to being a contributing member of the community. you are being very shortsighted.


4

for some reason, you are treating new players as if they are some valuable commodity. they are not. there are tons of new players every week and they are incredibly replaceable. somehow you think an anonymous brand new player is worth more than dreadlord, for example. if this game hadn't died, people like that would still be playing. if the infrastructure doesn't change, you'll lose the next dreadlord just like the last one. boredom. if your strategy for building the game consists of you sitting in a casual fort server teaching people how to grind, treating each own like a special butterfly, you will fail. it's about building an infrastructure. if you don't understand what this means, shut the **** up and think about it before posting again.

5

you can keep sitting on forums and moaning and whining or you can do something. It's easy to ignore people like you who just sit and complain and never do anything themselves. you've never done anything to help this game. Not only have you never contributed anything, you've never even tried. You contribute nothing and then complain about the people who do. I tried to get you to do a video, you said you were interested, then you made up fake excuses for four months and never did it. You're a parasitic zero. Don't sit there and complain about the few people who have the audacity to try.

you should count yourself lucky the ladle even existed when you started playing it. don't have the gall to come here and lecture me. learn your history, then apologize and thank me.
Last edited by blondie on Sun Nov 02, 2014 3:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by kyle » Sun Nov 02, 2014 3:09 am

Magi wrote: We could complain about server hosts leaving a server for tournament that requires GID to play, but how often do you see people in those servers when it isn't the tournament? Most of us will go to a public fort server or a public sumo server to play. Most of the time people want to use a Ladle server or a WST server it's when they want to war, which they should be allowed to do, so I don't see the problem with leaving a server up that doesn't get much use outside of its tournament day. When someone wants to fort or sumo they go to Empha's, Sumo Dive, Megafort lagless, Kyle's Nyc, dbd fortress. As far as I know those servers don't require a GID to play.
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I will have to say I agree with magi about having a very select subset to play in a server may not be the best, But i also know there can be issues with opening it up to others, Flower power was locked to @forums when it had a ladder. (but I believe it was still open to others to play)
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by blondie » Sun Nov 02, 2014 3:18 am

the idea that it's "a or b not both" is incorrect

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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by Monkey » Sun Nov 02, 2014 2:04 pm

Blondie/Concord/Sheep/... it is commendable that you are trying to bring some life back into the game, however I too don't like the idea of requiring a different GID to play.
Blondie wrote:you are treating new players as if they are some valuable commodity. they are not. there are tons of new players every week and they are incredibly replaceable.
Actually, they are a valuable commodity. It's sad that most of the community doesn't get that, which is why we are much smaller than we should be. Also, as Magi said, many of the older players have commitments and have left the game due to these. Some of the older players may not play the game for reasons you are saying but they are in the minority.
Blondie wrote:you've never done anything to help this game. Not only have you never contributed anything, you've never even tried. You contribute nothing and then complain about the people who do
He has, he just hasn't bragged about it. This coming Ladle we have a new team consisting of fasttrack players. Magi has played his part in helping them more than any other non fasttrack player.
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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by Monkey » Sun Nov 02, 2014 2:04 pm

Blondie/Concord/Sheep/... it is commendable that you are trying to bring some life back into the game, however I too don't like the idea of requiring a different GID to play.
Blondie wrote:you are treating new players as if they are some valuable commodity. they are not. there are tons of new players every week and they are incredibly replaceable.
Actually, they are a valuable commodity. It's sad that most of the community doesn't get that, which is why we are much smaller than we should be. Also, as Magi said, many of the older players have commitments and have left the game due to these. Some of the older players may not play the game for reasons you are saying but they are in the minority.
Blondie wrote:you've never done anything to help this game. Not only have you never contributed anything, you've never even tried. You contribute nothing and then complain about the people who do
He has, he just hasn't bragged about it. This coming Ladle we have a new team consisting of fasttrack players. Magi has played his part in helping them more than any other non fasttrack player.
Playing since December 2006

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Re: Sumo Bar with stats

Post by Phytotron » Tue Nov 04, 2014 1:24 am

blondie wrote:this criticism coming from someone who once played 24 straight hours of casual sumobar, it makes sense that you to not have any notion of the quality difference between competition and casual play. GIDs are used to enable a lot of added value in this server. Maybe the reason so many people who quit this game is because in between tournaments there's no games worth playing. You're an idiot if you think you can solve systemic problems by just sitting in casual servers for a month and getting a bunch of noobs to start playing.
People quit this game—and never became regulars in the first place—precisely because of the addition of Fortress and other gimmicky gamemodes and rules. And because of attitudes like yours, this "competitive" vs "casual" nonsense.

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