There was a day where..

What do you want to see here? Some more categories, forums, and mods? Hmm...
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Hoax
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Hoax »

How come only epsy's moderation has come under scrutiny

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Lucifer
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Lucifer »

I think he's the only one really moderating right now.
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LucK
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by LucK »

Er because his moderation is the only one that needs to be under scutiny :\

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MrsKsr
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by MrsKsr »

Look, if you didn't act like little babies people wouldn't need to moderate your posts. It's really not too much to ask for people to act in a respectable manner. Stop complaining, this forum would have imploded had mods not been introduced.

As for epsy's moderation, it's quite effective. Why would you allow people to flame and leave the bait there? Do you really want a forum full of bullshit? I know I don't.. Either way, I'm pretty sure he does more for this game than you even know and you wanna scrutinise his moderation? When you devote as much time and effort as he and any of the other devs do to this game (other than playing it) then come complain about how they run the forum. Untill then, suck it up. This whining is pathetic.

It may be the community forum but that doesn't mean you can do whatever the hell you want here. Have some god damn respect. Not only for the devs but for the community. Jeez.
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Concord »

those with power are always right and should never be questioned.

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MrsKsr
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by MrsKsr »

Nope. Those with the bigger gun should never be questioned :) Regardless of if theyre right or wrong* but hey, your funeral ;)

Anyway.. Yea I exploded a bit there.. but I just think people really need to stop complaining.. You treat him like a dictator or something. But what you need to realise is, that kind of behaviour is really bad. Watching a topic turn to flame is just aggravating, for those in the topic and for those who watch it.. Dude, if you want to argue or measure your penis sizes, go make a separate topic.. Storming sensible topics with garbage is just.. :S
"You may say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one;
I hope some day you will join us, and the world can live as one"


“Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word, a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring, all of which have the potential to turn a life around.”

I believe that to truly love is the ultimate expression of the will to live.

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Re: There was a day where..

Post by LucK »

Dubs don't act like you have never done anything that qualifies as flame/bait anyone. This is a forum with people and people have ideas and thoughts and I know I have done stuff that goes against what I say now but still if you don't want to hear or read other people's opinions then er cut yourself off from all contact of the world. If I wanted to measure my penis size I would send you a picture and ask you if mine is bigger because we all know you have cybered with like every guy on tron..
Last edited by LucK on Sun Mar 28, 2010 3:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

Concord
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Concord »

I think that we should try to make 'I' statements instead of "you" statements. And I would enjoy reading less indicative around here as well.

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Phytotron
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Phytotron »

The problem is epsy seems to be averse to any hint of controversy. To him, every cinder looks like a massive bonfire, quaint dissent is a riot about to explode, every cough is imminent pneumonia. He's a hypochondriac of moderation. He's getting OCD over the sterility (his interpretation thereof, anyway) of this forum, going around putting sanitiser on anything remotely disagreeable—to him.

He talks about "there was a day where[sic]," but this forum has always had disagreements and such—before he signed up, and before I signed up. Moreover, he apparently can't make the distinction between a substantive comment, criticism, or argument (regardless of its tone); and shallow, invective, malicious "flame" or "flamebait" made for its own sake, or to "troll." They're equal, in his mind. A scathing critical review of a novel is equivalent in nature to making harassing phone calls and threats to an author. The latter is what needs to be dealt with, not the former.

Looks like my initial reservations have turned out to be predictions.

Who really wants to participate in a forum where we all have to be huge fakes and can never express our actual, genuine opinions? We all must pretend to enjoy one another, get along, be nicey-nice, never disagree, or if we do, couch it in absurd extravagances of evasion-english, relativism, and phony polity? "Yes, I see what you're saying, I respect it, I honor your feelings, your point is valid, as valid and true as any other. I believe that I might have a different view, no offense intended, which, if I may, I would like to oh, so humbly and in utmost modesty relate, that is if it's OK with you and there's no potential that it might stir any slightly unpleasant feelings in you. May I proceed?"

"People felt like posting their opinion freely." Oops, nevermind. Opinions must be stated in a manner as approved by the Epsy Forum Polity Protocol (ambiguous and rife with contradiction and unreason as it may be).


And incidentally, with respect to his "there was a day" comments about off-topic posts and splits, Z-Man and Lucifer have already pointed out—not only in this thread, but also, believe it or not, others!—that is false, too.


And I still want an explanation why making a lighthearted comment comparing a gameplay style to a silly children's game is worse, more offensive, more unacceptable than making a joke and glib slang out of rape. Do you have a ******* clue, epsy? Seriously.

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Phytotron
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Phytotron »

For example (just because it's readily available), this is substantive (however poor its syntax and grammar):
LucK wrote:Dubs don't act like you have never done anything that qualifies as flame/bait anyone. This is a forum with people and people have ideas and thoughts and I know I have done stuff that goes against what I say now but still if you don't want to hear or read other people's opinions then er cut yourself off from all contact of the world.
Whereas, this is the kind of garbage that would justify censure:
If I wanted to measure my penis size I would send you a picture and ask you if mine is bigger because we all know you have cybered with like every guy on tron..
Do you get the distinction?

And I do deliberately use the term censure.

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Lucifer
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Lucifer »

Phytotron: I'll remind you that a lot of folks here aren't native english speakers, and I could see having problems distinguishing between "censure" and "censor". Hell, a lot of native english speakers don't know the difference.

In my not-so-humble opinion, the only real job of moderators is to stop flamewars after they start. Maybe splitting off-topic threads when the original topic is still active as well as the off-topic topic.

Otherwise, it's a can of worms. People get mad from time to time and post stuff they later think twice over. Most of the time, the post stands and is left alone, no fight develops over it. Trying to *prevent* flamewars isn't really within the range of what can be achieved with mod powers. It's like that movie, I think the one with Tom Cruise in it (yeah, that narrows it down). Ummmm, where they catch murderers before they commit the murder and send them prison. You don't know that trouble is starting until it develops into actual trouble.

Also, let's try to avoid the moved-into-a-new-house effect here. You know, where you hated your old place so you moved into a new place. After a few weeks you start finding that the new place isn't perfect either. Having moderators isn't supposed to establish utopia here, it's to avoid situations like we were in not too long ago where we inarguably needed a moderator but there was none to be found.
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Patchman5000
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Patchman5000 »

epsy wrote:Again, you didn't get a warning, it's there to say "don't be idiots and respond aggressively to this", because there are people who totally would..
"I dislike this game"

"Responding aggressively because the game rocks"

"PSEUDO WARNING! You shouldn't have told people you disliked the game, now they are all going to get into an argument that the game isn't bad!"

People take offense to EVERYTHING online, if you want to tell people to "not be offended by ____ and ____" you might as well put a large sign up when they access the forums warning them that they are on the internet... "legal things that happen regularly on the internet may occur here don't get offended!"

I dunno, it just seems pointless. We aren't baby proofing the forums or anything, [most of] these people are competent adults, they can handle it. If it DOES get heated and flames start breaking out, feel free to moderate it. But there's no point in playing the "lets alter the space time continuum" game and prevent anything from ever happening by putting people in large foam suits with sound proof helmets.

Dunno, just my 2¢.

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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Word »

Phytotron wrote:"Yes, I see what you're saying, I respect it, I honor your feelings, your point is valid, as valid and true as any other. I believe that I might have a different view, no offense intended, which, if I may, I would like to oh, so humbly and in utmost modesty relate, that is if it's OK with you and there's no potential that it might stir any slightly unpleasant feelings in you. May I proceed?"
do you mind if i put that in my signature, without the quotes? :P

In the few situations where a topic became so obnoxious that it deserved to be locked there weren't any mods. Now we have mods, but it seems to become even worse (which is our own fault).
When I post something I feel responsible for it; the forum isn't full of wimps as far as I can tell.
That said, it's my fault if I post crap and get the reaction I can expect. Of course it is stupid to post something just to break a taboo or to provoke people for no reason (-> Cloaket).

I don't have anything against the forums' moderators, but I don't like the whole concept of moderation in general.
I would only edit posts if they are extremely offensive, but even then it shouldn't change the direction of the post (for example i would replace "asshole" with "idiot"), otherwise its whole context might get lost.
I would NOT warn users by editing/deleting their text and sending them a PM (or how else do you do it? wasn't warned yet - sorry if my previous post was misleading some people - though it wasn't childish ), and create a meaningless cloze.
If someone keeps writing posts I don't like, I can use the foe function or else I try to impose my own point of view ;) .

Why do the forums have to be "family-friendly"? No families here... that doesn't mean I'd prefer an unfriendly place but I would hate to be part of it when most of the friendliness is constrained.

-----------------------------------

IMO both the moderators and the rest of the community should agree on rules or at least clear guidelines (which shouldn't be too strict) to ensure that the moderators don't abuse their power and if they use it they aren't blamed just for doing their job.

edit: dang, i'll also miss the cartoons
Lucifer wrote:It's like that movie, I think the one with Tom Cruise in it (yeah, that narrows it down). Ummmm, where they catch murderers before they commit the murder and send them prison. You don't know that trouble is starting until it develops into actual trouble.
it reminded of the lobotomy scene in "one flew over the cuckoo's nest" xD
Last edited by Word on Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:27 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Patchman5000
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by Patchman5000 »

Lucifer wrote:Phytotron: I'll remind you that a lot of folks here aren't native english speakers, and I could see having problems distinguishing between "censure" and "censor". Hell, a lot of native english speakers don't know the difference.

In my not-so-humble opinion, the only real job of moderators is to stop flamewars after they start. Maybe splitting off-topic threads when the original topic is still active as well as the off-topic topic.

Otherwise, it's a can of worms. People get mad from time to time and post stuff they later think twice over. Most of the time, the post stands and is left alone, no fight develops over it. Trying to *prevent* flamewars isn't really within the range of what can be achieved with mod powers. It's like that movie, I think the one with Tom Cruise in it (yeah, that narrows it down). Ummmm, where they catch murderers before they commit the murder and send them prison. You don't know that trouble is starting until it develops into actual trouble.

Also, let's try to avoid the moved-into-a-new-house effect here. You know, where you hated your old place so you moved into a new place. After a few weeks you start finding that the new place isn't perfect either. Having moderators isn't supposed to establish utopia here, it's to avoid situations like we were in not too long ago where we inarguably needed a moderator but there was none to be found.
EDIT: Minority Report

Haha, didn't read this entire page before posting my last post.. but that's the EXACT movie I had in my mind when I made my post :P I can't remember the name either, but it was ridiculous to mess with the future or whatever just cuz of a little wooden ball (I think it was) that said you were gunna be a bad guy. With the exception of Epsy not having a little ball, but instead having an over-zealous moderation strategy.

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MrsKsr
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Re: There was a day where..

Post by MrsKsr »

*sigh*

Luck; I find it amazing that you can defend your idiotic behaviour, yet in the same post 'attack' me with the same useless bullshit I was referring to in the first place. I've never seen such idiocy trying to be justified.. If you expect me to retaliate by 'flaming' you, then be disappointed. If you have something against me then fine, either talk to me about it or keep it off this thread. Period.

All I'm saying is; If you have something to say, then say it, but make it about the topic. Just because you have a personal problem with a person, that does not mean it should be posted on a public thread. I think nearly everybody here is sick of little 'feuds' breaking out between people who have some kind of history. So just stop doing it, if you won't the mods will help you. It's not really THAT difficult of a concept to grasp is it?
"You may say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one;
I hope some day you will join us, and the world can live as one"


“Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word, a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring, all of which have the potential to turn a life around.”

I believe that to truly love is the ultimate expression of the will to live.

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