some crazy ideas

What do you want to see in Armagetron soon? Any new feature ideas? Let's ponder these ground breaking ideas...
juwb
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some crazy ideas

Post by juwb »

Hi,

first off: I've never ever seen the movie. Probably not much room for ideas if you have to stick strictly to the movie, huh?

Anyway, here goes.

1. Slopes.

The flat floor is so boring... why not put some slopes in it? So you could build maps with hills on it. You get slower driving up a slope and faster going down another. And of course you never know what's waiting for you on the other side of the hill...

2. Floor types

There could be different floor types, that could affect the way your bike changes direction or grinds/brakes... for example, a sand pit that slows you down considerably... or an oil field that doesn't let you change direction easily. If you have ever played Enigma, you know what I'm talking about.

3. Powerups

It would be fun if there were powerups randomly appearing on the floor. There would be lots of possibilities, like speed up, longer wall, better brakes, a gun with limited ammunition you can blast your way through walls with, a mine that you can place on a wall while grinding it, and the next one to grind that wall goes boom, a turbo you can use only once for speed up, ...

4. Obstacles

Someone on this forum made a baddass model of some big robot or something. Would be cool to have one of those walking around, tearing down walls and trampling bikes... other static obstacles could be interesting too. I think there is some work in that direction already to get rid of the boring box.

5. Wraparound mode

What would happen if there were no borders, but instead the map wraps just around and around? Not sure if this can be done in 3D...

Something similar could be achieved if instead of a cube rim the cycles could just drive up the cube walls, so you had actually 6 floors to fill (so you can drive on the floor, on the walls, and on the ceiling).

6. Map editor

Well, this one is self-explaining :)

7. Health bar instead of rubber/crash?

Instead of rubber, you could have a health bar (that does not fill itself back up). This would allow for games that are similar to those popular (?) high rubber servers, without it being abused too much. So everytime you use much rubber, it costs you some health, so you can't do it infinitely.

8. Melee game mode

Instead of having to wait until the round is over, I think it'd be fun if you could just go directly back onto the field. So camping around just to stay alive wouldn't do you any good, you'd actually have to frag as many opponents as possible to win.

9. Top-down (bird's eye) camera

I'd like a top-down view with some extra knick-knacks. First, it should zoom automatically... generally it should show 2/3 of what's in front of me and 1/3 of what's behind me. It should zoom in when I go slow, and zoom out when I go fast.

When there is an enemy approaching and getting close enough, it should zoom out far enough so I can see myself and the enemy.

Plus, there should be a circular graphic on screen showing the direction and distance of all enemies that are not in range of my bird's eye camera yet.

I've seen other games use something like this (can't remember the game name though). I think it'd be similar to the radar I've seen mentioned elsewhere in this forum, but with a bird's eye camera, this radar could be full screen (designating name and distance and direction by just putting the name and distance at the appropriate position on the screen border).

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Jonathan
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Re: some crazy ideas

Post by Jonathan »

juwb wrote:3. Powerups

It would be fun if there were powerups randomly appearing on the floor. There would be lots of possibilities, like speed up, longer wall, better brakes, a gun with limited ammunition you can blast your way through walls with, a mine that you can place on a wall while grinding it, and the next one to grind that wall goes boom, a turbo you can use only once for speed up, ...
Speed: Often not desirable.
Mines on a wall you're grinding: Mine ends up between two walls.
juwb wrote:4. Obstacles
Static obstacles are already possible using obstacle walls.
juwb wrote:5. Wraparound mode

What would happen if there were no borders, but instead the map wraps just around and around? Not sure if this can be done in 3D...
Of course it's possible in 3D (graphics would be a different story), and this is/was being worked on. The game is 2D internally btw.
juwb wrote:7. Health bar instead of rubber/crash?
Set CYCLE_RUBBER_TIME to some insane value.
juwb wrote:9. Top-down (bird's eye) camera
The custom cam is close.

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TiTnAsS
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Post by TiTnAsS »

i agree with jon, most of these ideas would ruin the game etc :)..

1 is not gonna happen
2 is not gonna happen
3 is not gonna happen
4 is not gonna happen
5 is being worked on
6 is already there if you do it using code but that can be done
7 is just stupid but you can do that if you set it so rubber dosnt come back and set some really high value
8 being worked on
9 is possible through custom camera settings
Damn, it sure has been a while!

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Self_Destructo
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Post by Self_Destructo »

I am going to refer someone to this post that is making a BZII mode of tron. He might be interested. Of a fact, he could use some programmers. :D

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TiTnAsS
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Post by TiTnAsS »

Link him here, there would most likely be the possibilty that it would be added to 1.0.0 as a different branch of the setting.
Damn, it sure has been a while!

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Self_Destructo
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Post by Self_Destructo »

Yeah, I linked him.

Cloaket

No thx

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I love incest
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Phytotron
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Post by Phytotron »

I think juwb's ideas are a lot of crap. I've made similar comments before. If you want those kinds of things, you're talking about a completely different game altogether. It's not Tron lightcycles. I'm already personally unhappy about the upcoming shaped arenas and multi-axis movement, but if anything like what has been suggested here were implemented, I think that would be an absolute ruination of the game.

Juwb, I think you want a different game. I suggest you try to find it somewhere else.

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Z-Man
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Post by Z-Man »

Please don't be so negative, Oscilloscope. I've said it before: the basic game as it was in the very beginning will not go away, no matter what we add on top of it. I'm strongly biased against robots or recognizers doing stuff (because it's meaningless and hard to do), and the overhead view (go play some 2d-tron, please), but the rest actually has some merit. The only problem is that those ideas are hardly new, most of them have been suggested in variations once or several times already.

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Phytotron
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Post by Phytotron »

Sorry, I don't mean to come off too awfully arsey. I was just giving my opinion on his open call for comment on his suggestions.

Just so youse know where I coming from, I suppose my view is largely based on a fondness for Tron. That's what originally drew me to the game. To paraphrase the little slogan, it's Tron in 3D. It gives me the ability to sorta play the lightcycle scene from the movie. (That's another reason I prefer smart cam, too.) Then after playing for awhile I came to apprectiate what one might call a "sophisticated simplicity" in the game. It's a simple concept with a simple arena and cycles that make simple movements (at least right now), but there's a sort of sophisitication (not to overstate it) that enters in when it comes to strategies, tactics, maneuvers, and so forth. I think that's damn cool. (Of course, a lot of that is player-dependent, but I won't digress into that. :wink: )

And sooo, the idea of adding the kinds of things suggested here, for me, sort of corrupts that, I guess you might say (again, not to overstate it). It would make it an entirely different game.

(An analogy could be drawn here to sports. Take any one that you enjoy—baseball, basketball, football, soccer/fútbol, tennis, track and field, etc. All are, at base, simple. What makes them continually fun, interesting, and alive is the skill, ability, and athleticism of the players coupled with the technique, formations, strategies, and plays that go into the gameplay. That's more than just good enough; it's what makes the game.

Now add in all kinds of unnecessary things like crazy power-ups, variously shaped fields, special abilities, obstacles, hungry lions, spaceships, and/or whatever. It's no longer the same game. Of course there will be people who like it. But more "purist" fans will find it ruined and will be turned away. The essential game has been basically lost in favor of these things.)

All that longwindedly said, this is just my single, solitary, individual opinion as a regular player. I'm just one player, and I'm not a developer, so obviously it's not up to me. I'm just sayin'. :)

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hang3r
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Post by hang3r »

I agree with oscilloscope.

i would think improving the graphics (and I don’t mean I wont a movie pack), could attract a lot more attention.

Keep it simple but there was some good suggestions in there (5 and 8 ), as TiTnAsS said there being worked on.

:D

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Tank Program
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Post by Tank Program »

TiTnAsS wrote:i agree with jon, most of these ideas would ruin the game etc :)..

1 is not gonna happen
2 is not gonna happen
3 is not gonna happen
4 is not gonna happen
5 is being worked on
6 is already there if you do it using code but that can be done
7 is just stupid but you can do that if you set it so rubber dosnt come back and set some really high value
8 being worked on
9 is possible through custom camera settings
Anything to do with mapping is more or less in the works, so don't say it's not gonna happen.
Image

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Z-Man
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Post by Z-Man »

Osci: Yes, I agree with that version, too. My own work will certainly not focus on crazy additions; we will make it possible for others to add them, though (that's what scripting capability is about). Game modes with less idling around (like 8 or variations of area-domination games) are what I'm missing most currently, so that's what I'll probably work on soon. They won't change the core gameplay, so it's still Tron, but they'll modify the set of strategies you have to employ.

juwb: you get some bonus points from me for not saying something like "I'm no programmer, but I bet this is easy to implement" :)

juwb
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Post by juwb »

z-man wrote:juwb: you get some bonus points from me for not saying something like "I'm no programmer, but I bet this is easy to implement" :)
You should probably take these points back and ban me from the forum, because I actually am a (hobby) programmer, know how hard these things are to implement, and still suggest it. :lol:

However, I never actually made anything worthwile in C/C++... I grew up with a scripting language with automatic memory (de)allocation, dynamically growing arrays, absolutely no type safety (mixed type arrays), and so on and so forth... so whenever I tried to write something in C, I hit a wall pretty soon, because there you have to do all these things by yourself.

juwb
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Post by juwb »

z-man wrote:and the overhead view (go play some 2d-tron, please)
2d-tron doesn't let you switch cameras whenever you please. I never said I wanted this overhead view exclusively. :-)

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