Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growing

General Stuff about Armagetron, That doesn't belong anywhere else...
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/dev/null
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by /dev/null »

Then set up a trust to pay for them next few years, otherwise, its just gonna end in tears AGAIN.

The console message on how to turn is brilliant, why havnt any of us thought of that before?

Olive
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by Olive »

this evening i logged into emphas sumo bar

the zone_alpha settings are at default, but i couldn't find the appropriate key for the command prompt. While trying out several keys, i'm apparently spamming instant chats and get a 60 minute ban.

not really noob-friendly indeed :<
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xXSyagehtllikXx
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by xXSyagehtllikXx »

Now, a newbie would not even know about zone_alpha or the command key :)
Last edited by Z-Man on Wed Feb 18, 2015 10:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: More fun than banning.

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ppotter
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by ppotter »

You should be able to type "/console blablabla" in normal chat if you don't know the key for console btw.

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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by Durf »

/dev/null wrote:Then set up a trust to pay for them next few years, otherwise, its just gonna end in tears AGAIN.

The console message on how to turn is brilliant, why havnt any of us thought of that before?
Please, anyone that has the money will just hire a real dev team.

And the current "ultimate fast track" server does have a round console message to teach users how to talk (so they can at least ask how to do things).
I have previously made help topics in the past to teach users how to use tron to its fullest (though I should mention that /help doesn't work in sty+ct and was fixed in sty+ct+ap - so obviously this isn't an option for most of the servers out there...way to go guys).
Plus, there are a couple training programs out there (some in the works) to teach a newbie and get them off the ground.
Plenty has been thought up already and some of those plans have been put into action (incidentally, there are more people from the fast track community doing things to help noobs than any LR game type - your patience must last as long as your rubber does)
One of the first things I tell people when I see they don't know how to boost (brake) or turn, is to spam the default controls ("V", "Z & X") - even if they don't know how to press S to talk yet, that usually gets them going (IMO being observant is crucial to being able to help them improve - knowing the problem is required before solving it).

<edit : as ppotter mentions (/console), that is how I tell newbies to change their cycle color - it's easier if they can repeat what you say than to teach them how to use a "console" [wtf is that to them? they don't know]. Little things like this all help make the learning process easier. >


The overall problem (when it comes to dev / helping out in tron) is both procrastination and apathy. (vs just sitting down and getting it done rather than chipping away at it little by little)
Do you play tron? Or do something productive for it? Do you even have time to do both?



Marginally related:
Something like "colored text" is not important (wasn't trying to say it was even valuable [to play tron] - but for the point of trying to answer a question when you're trying to coordinate with a team - not good), but it is still something to learn. The fact remains that it is something to do; a capability users can have. How it is done isn't easy (it's not like we can just do "/green this text is green"); the purpose of me pointing out that particular example was just to show how it is better to explain things like that (or anything really) in a server where the gameplay isn't as competitive (or otherwise won't matter so much if they themselves die/lose - they aren't part of a team and others aren't depending on their performance).

As for the value of "colored text": it's not valuable in any way when it comes to playing the game. And yet, I can replicate any color just by looking at it; I can know your cycle code just by looking at it. So while it may not have any value when it comes to the game itself; it's nice to be able to make any color you want on a whim (requires knowledge of how colors mix, and knowledge of hexadecimal / base 16 math).

You're right (blondie) when you imply that it isn't valuable or relevant; but it makes a good token example of something that is asked by noobs ("how to get double colors" / "use the console" is another big one - I could have used any example, my point was the differences in the server environment and what it means for the individual who is trying to learn tron as a whole)


<edit2 : Why doesn't anyone explore the menus anymore? Why do people expect to know what they're playing? Games weren't made with tutorials in the past - you learned by trying everything you could. For me, any game that I play I start playing it by exploring EVERY SINGLE MENU and knowing my capability before even playing - meaning I discovered which key was the console key and how to change it to the key I wanted (global keyboard configuration in system settings I think). So really the newbies are partially at fault and there are some that just cannot be taught as they don't have the true willingness to learn.
Sidenote: spam protection messages should probably be clearer when you're about to be banned / @Olive, why didn't you just ask someone? >

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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by Olive »

because i was banned from the server
eventually found it by exploring the menus

its no cry against the server policy, just an everyday example of how the grid might not be the noobfriendliest place

thanks potter, can use that in advance when i forget the key binding again :mrgreen:
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by aP|Nelg »

ppotter wrote:You should be able to type "/console blablabla" in normal chat if you don't know the key for console btw.
you can... and /console IS the exact command!

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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by S0lutai »

The client itself it's not a friendly place, and so is not the game.

Anyone ever played league of legends? Not comparing it to tron at all matter, but, when you are low level (a.k.a. noob or newbie) there's always a big message in the screen telling you what to do during whole match. I've known by experience people that don't like having to figure out what can you do because it's tedious and boring. Really. People want to jump into the game's action. I mean they didn't download/pay it to do anything else besides playing. Unless you want to tune the game at your way, which everyone does when they are a bit more experienced.
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vov
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by vov »

Armagetron v0.4 does have a tutorial with many of the exact things you want, often even bigger and better (center messages ftw).

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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by S0lutai »

vov wrote:Armagetron v0.4 does have a tutorial with many of the exact things you want, often even bigger and better (center messages ftw).
This has already been discussed (older posts on this thread).
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vov
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by vov »

Well, you're as guilty as I am of not reading the whole thread then. :-)

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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by Lucifer »

Back to the last off-topic topic:

Why not stick to default settings? Well, it turns out that the default settings are also every bit as arbitrary as any list of settings YOU have to offer.

In short, infinite walls don't create much in the way of competition, but they can be fun (Tigers Network FTW!!!).

If we're going to favor some servers over others, then their settings need to favor competition and socialization over camping.

Which, well, High Rubber is the definition of camping....
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vov
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by vov »

Maybe something with a simple map rotation? CTWF was very popular with new players in the past, even though there was the barrier of "wtf is fort" on that server, and I think it was because of the maps (and generally exciting stuff happening because of them).
Doesn't have to be super special stuff, something like in the tutorial with simple obstacles would be good.

@Lucifer: Should I try making settings that try to do all that or was that a rhetorical question because the defaults could be alright at that? :D

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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by Lucifer »

vov wrote:Maybe something with a simple map rotation? CTWF was very popular with new players in the past, even though there was the barrier of "wtf is fort" on that server, and I think it was because of the maps (and generally exciting stuff happening because of them).
Doesn't have to be super special stuff, something like in the tutorial with simple obstacles would be good.
Map rotation is a great idea. I'd suggest keeping match win and scoring the same for each map and not varying physics much.
@Lucifer: Should I try making settings that try to do all that or was that a rhetorical question because the defaults could be alright at that? :D
It was rhetorical. ;) But i wouldn't want to discount the educational benefits of being stuck in a box.

Remind me to split this discussion when i get home, it's become a topic in its own right.
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Re: Armagetron is NOT dead, here's why and how to keep growi

Post by S0lutai »

Putting all (any) of this ideas running anytime soon? I wouldn't let this topic die and make all this ideas become "yet another topic" tbh.
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