First impressions

[Lucifer]

Ok, so, anybody who's been following my recent ventures out into the world....

On those other forums that have the really hyperactive mods, I've found something else to be true. They don't get over first impressions. Not at all. My first impression there was judged badly by some (because it was a tale of me getting arrested recently, and if you're not following my web comic, this is news to you, and I don't feel sorry for you) based on stereotypes. A couple has a fight, the man gets arrested, he's obviously abusive.

Not telling that story, to be honest, and I didn't tell it there. Not the fight. Only the arrest itself (because it was interesting to that community). But the fight is a private matter, and I know that here that privacy will be respected.

I know that because of what the first impression I made was when I first came here. See, I apparently have a history of splashing down rather than sneaking in, even though I've always seen myself as a sneaker and not a splasher.

When I came here, there was a member (we called him Sab, but I don't remember his full name. Edit: Sabarai, now I remember ) who had posted a picture of him wearing a boy scout uniform and invited everybody to photoshop it. So I photoshopped it (GIMPed, really) to make him into a genie's bottle with a genie coming out of his neck and then urinating in his mouth.

Oh the calls for the bans were immediate. Even Tank Program suggested a ban might be warranted, but cautioned against a knee jerk reaction, based in part on my other posts at that time, and in part because he's actually not a smeghead but a pretty nice guy.

So the calls for bans were immediate, but in the long run, was a ban warranted?

So those of you whining about how you made such bad first impressions that people keep hating on you are really not in a position to whine. Because I made a worse first impression than 99% of you, and look where that ultimately got me. If people are still hating on you, maybe you should be looking at your second, third, and fourth impressions, and anything else after that.

I'm quite entertained by the contrast between the two places, obviously, but over there I can't post about it because of rules. Not that that would stop me from posting over here about it, it just means I can't copy and paste.

[Light]

People put too much emphasis on first impressions. You don't know a person at that point, though you may have an opinion of an action they've done, it doesn't mean you understood everything correctly, or that they are like that much of the time. People can also change ..

What you did sounds .. interesting. Inviting the internet to edit a picture is asking for far worse than that, but here you don't have quite as many people that would do it. And +1 for being a GIMPer. lol

When it comes to your story of being arrested, I feel like you should have expected the reaction you got. Not because it's most likely true, but because that's generally what people suspect, and it's no secret. I assume you've learned to think that through a little more though. I usually avoid posting about my private life to people I don't really know, but it seems for most any more it's normal.

People here are pretty tolerant when it comes to a lot of things. It may be that you tend to forget people, but I've seen people go from bein' assholes to someone you could actually talk to, and people here seem willing to give second chances. Hell, if you really pay care to give someone a chance, even people like Swag ain't as bad as they appear. They may do stupid things once in a while, but most is tolerable.

So, now I got three questions. What resulted from your picture? Do you still have it to show? And how did it turn out for you over there? I assume something went wrong from the fact that you posted, but just curious.

You make that place sound like a pretty boring place to be. Sounds full of pointless rules and over-sensitive moderators that would take the fun out of being a part of a community. I'm not even sure the community sounds so appealing. Maybe it's more serious or important topic that shouldn't include "fun", but I'm not sure you ever really specified.

Is it really as bad as it sounds? What keeps you there?

Okay, I'm done asking questions. Just a tad curious after seeing ya post a little about it now.

[Lucifer]

People put too much emphasis on first impressions. You don't know a person at that point, though you may have an opinion of an action they've done, it doesn't mean you understood everything correctly, or that they are like that much of the time. People can also change ..

Indeed. There's a high likelihood I could go through your post history and find smegheadery, and here we don't worry so much about it. It takes MANY posts and MANY actions for an overall judgment to be made (and there are those we've done that with).

When it comes to your story of being arrested, I feel like you should have expected the reaction you got. Not because it's most likely true, but because that's generally what people suspect, and it's no secret. I assume you've learned to think that through a little more though. I usually avoid posting about my private life to people I don't really know, but it seems for most any more it's normal.

That argument was made over there. And it's not like I didn't expect the reaction, I just felt the reaction was wrong because it was fundamentally prejudiced. You see, what happened was the opposite. I didn't commit an assault against my wife, it was the other way around. The difference was that I shielded her from being arrested, and she didn't shield me, and the police procedures being what they were..... the charges were dropped.

So yes, my expectation didn't match what I wanted out of it. True. No argument there.

But I've gotten random passive-aggressive comments made against me, and tonight a PM directly about it (based on a completely unrelated story that's really a fun story about me and a friend pranking a loss prevention person at a retail shop, but it ended with an accidental shoplifting by my friend, for which we went back and tried to pay for, but couldn't because they didn't carry it anymore. Silly story, but integrity throughout).

So, now I got three questions. What resulted from your picture?

I ultimately was invited to be one of the 3 evil triumvirates for Armagetron Advanced.

The immediate result was basically "do nothing and see", and I just kept behaving like I am, with the attitude that if I got booted from here, then this wasn't a place I belonged. I didn't get booted, and you can look through the archives to see what happened (there's a lot, but the time period on this is 2004-2005).

Do you still have it to show?

Yes. I still have a copy of it. I am not willing to show it until Sabarai tells me he's OK with it. Not publicly, anyway, but I've exchanged it with quite a few people privately. There are other people here who know this story.... (Hi Neal!)

And how did it turn out for you over there? I assume something went wrong from the fact that you posted, but just curious.

Nothing over the original post. I've acquired a few friends and a few enemies. Basically what you'd expect from me, because I can be quite a polarizing figure. As to the specific incident of bullying in a PM, I took it up with moderators and am waiting to hear back from them.

Not sure they'll respond well, since I blatantly criticized them in the PM exchange, and they hate that, so we'll see.

Is it really as bad as it sounds? What keeps you there?

It's a crossdresser support forum. I joined it looking for friends and fun, because I'm in a position where I don't need emotional support. However, the primary purpose of the forum is to provide emotional support, and all the rules are designed to do that. Which means a lot of fun is drained from the place in order to ensure that emotional support is always available.

Compared to there, this place is downright anarchy.

But the two places are fundamentally quite different. Here, transparency is taken as a given, and when people don't provide it, they are pushed into it or shunned. Here, I have to be out in the open, because if me and Z-man went behind closed doors, people would get paranoid (and not only do we accept that that's the case, we encourage people to think that way. The only private conversation me and Z-man have ever had involved me being invited as the third triumvir, and me asking him to come to my wedding, which ended up being extremely private and nobody was invited). I love being out in the open. I'm used to working where people can see me.

Over there, it's different. Transparency isn't considered helpful, and when providing emotional support, adding a transparency requirement isn't just burdensome, it's contradictory.

So their rules make sense for what they're doing. And frankly, if you're not transgender in any way (or dating someone who is), then that place isn't for you.

When I see the two places contrasted, it's ALWAYS because of a difference in purpose. But for the first impressions thing, the lady who PM'd me (who, shall we say, was born a boy) was clearly pushing a grudge and enforcing a first iimpression judgment. Sampling bias. If I talk about people doing illegal things, then I'm a criminal. If I talk to a genetic girl about how to deal with her husband being a crossdresser, I'm just a voice and she doesn't even see the name. Sampling bias based on a prejudice. And THAT is what's different here, based on my first impression here.

To end this post, I'm willing to repost the Sabarai pic if Tank Program says it's ok to do so. Sab hasn't been here in years, after all.....

[Light]

Indeed. There's a high likelihood I could go through your post history and find smegheadery, and here we don't worry so much about it. It takes MANY posts and MANY actions for an overall judgment to be made (and there are those we've done that with).

Hopefully not TOO many. I actually haven't gotten into many of the conversations here, unless I've forgotten. That edu. thread was about my first, and apparently I can't explain my thoughts very well, so I should probably avoid it some. The bad part, that pushes me to feel like doing it more so it hopefully improves, even though that would likely just cause more problems.

At least when it comes to religion, which is probably my most debated thing because of my stance, people love to tell me what I'm like, that I can talk a bit better. Though, that's usually a fight that you don't go into planning to make them understand anything. Wow, I think I've jumped off topic ..

That argument was made over there. And it's not like I didn't expect the reaction, I just felt the reaction was wrong because it was fundamentally prejudiced. You see, what happened was the opposite. I didn't commit an assault against my wife, it was the other way around. The difference was that I shielded her from being arrested, and she didn't shield me, and the police procedures being what they were..... the charges were dropped.

So yes, my expectation didn't match what I wanted out of it. True. No argument there.

This is something that actually bothers me. People pretend it don't happen, or if it does they are happy to call ya a pussy, but it's not always "small weak woman vs big man" as it seems people like to think. There's also the problem that many people, such as myself, would not hit back unless it was completely necessary. Not saying I'd just take it, but I'm not one for physical fights.

Also, without really knowing details, I don't see how jumping to the assumption would be very useful, unless you have nothing to do but hate on someone. There are countless, stupid little things that you can be arrested for.

I ultimately was invited to be one of the 3 evil triumvirates for Armagetron Advanced.

The immediate result was basically "do nothing and see", and I just kept behaving like I am, with the attitude that if I got booted from here, then this wasn't a place I belonged. I didn't get booted, and you can look through the archives to see what happened (there's a lot, but the time period on this is 2004-2005).

Interesting how you go from that to mod, I gotta admit.

Yes. I still have a copy of it. I am not willing to show it until Sabarai tells me he's OK with it. Not publicly, anyway, but I've exchanged it with quite a few people privately. There are other people here who know this story.... (Hi Neal!)

To end this post, I'm willing to repost the Sabarai pic if Tank Program says it's ok to do so. Sab hasn't been here in years, after all.....

It's not really too important if it shouldn't be posted. It just sounds ... "interesting" may be the closest word. lol

Not sure they'll respond well, since I blatantly criticized them in the PM exchange, and they hate that, so we'll see.

I have problems with people in power that can't take criticism. I've been banned from a few places for this, and for the fact that they don't like to be questioned about their actions, even if they involve you. When they have no idea what they're talking about and are enforcing crap on people, I have a hard time keeping my mouth shut.

"To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" -Voltaire

Is it really as bad as it sounds? What keeps you there?

It's a crossdresser support forum. I joined it looking for friends and fun, because I'm in a position where I don't need emotional support. However, the primary purpose of the forum is to provide emotional support, and all the rules are designed to do that. Which means a lot of fun is drained from the place in order to ensure that emotional support is always available.[/quote]
That explains a lot, but I don't quite agree with their strictness. I'm on similar forums, for a different topic but not getting into it here. There are the assholes and trolls that come around, but people are pretty much there in the same boat, and they're usually going to treat you well. I agree strict on rules is good for a place like that, but a lot of the rules you say here don't seem to be useful for much other than someone's OCD being kept calm. lol

The one I'm in, people still have the freedom to talk 'n have fun with lots else, and the people are more than happy to stop what they're doing to help someone. Maybe there's a difference in the type of people each gets? I don't know. I just assume that people there would have no problem treating each other with respect since everyone is there for the same reason, or at least should be understanding of what they're going through. I guess they've probably had experiences that have shown otherwise.

Compared to there, this place is downright anarchy.

Picturing a tron riot in the streets now. Oh god ..

[delinquent]

It's human nature to over-react more easily in this environment. Subconsciously, we know that we don't know this new guy, and for all we know he could be a right fucktard.

There are various issues surrounding behavior on the internet, and this sort of thing is in now way going to be resolved soon. Perhaps this sabarai kid made an error in judgment inviting people to shop his photo. What do you think would have happened on 4chan?

It makes much more sense to keep yourself to yourself. However, if we all did so, none of use would have any friends at all. Life in general contains a lot of risk taking. This is just a part of it. Take a chance to make someone laugh. If someone else is offended, it's not your resposibility to give a flying ****. It is, however, the responsibility of the person whom is offended to remember and accept that not everybody has an identical sense of humour.

[Phytotron]

When I came here, there was a member (we called him Sab, but I don't remember his full name. Edit: Sabarai, now I remember ) who had posted a picture of him wearing a boy scout uniform and invited everybody to photoshop it.

Here are a couple later ones in which I participated. I like that he left his account with the alien avatar I made, heh.

New avatar
Anyone? Or is it getting annoying?

This is something that actually bothers me. People pretend it don't happen

Didn't we already go over this? Considering something like 90% of violent crimes overall, and roughly 80% of domestic abuse cases, are perpetrated by men, it's a reasonable assumption.

Based on this comment and previous ones, I have the sneaking suspicion you've been browsing some "men's rights" websites, and if so you need to quit that shit.

If someone else is offended, it's not your resposibility to give a flying ****.

Of course it is. What the hell is wrong with you?

[Light]

Based on this comment and previous ones, I have the sneaking suspicion you've been browsing some "men's rights" websites, and if so you need to quit that shit.

You would be wrong. But when it comes to domestic violence, it's pretty even between both sexes. Some studies even show women having a higher rate, though it also shows more injuries by men onto women. And this had nothing to do with the previous topics.

[Mecca]

HI LUCIFER! How are you doing?

[delinquent]

Of course it is. What the hell is wrong with you?

So I'm supposed to walk around on eggshells for fear of offending anyone at all? No. It is the recipient whom chooses how to process information. If you're offended by, for example, the word "spoon", should I describe spoons as "those scooping instruments"? Of course not. There are, of course, limits to this philosophy, but in a world where everyone's limits are different it is our duty as cognitive people to recognise that some peoples limits are less confining than ours.

[sinewav]

But when it comes to domestic violence, it's pretty even between both sexes. Some studies even show women having a higher rate, though it also shows more injuries by men onto women.

Time to start citing sources. I am honestly curious to know more about this. While I've never acted violently toward my girlfriends I have taken more than a couple hits from them (and unsuccessfully dodged objects flying in my direction). Though if I ever did fight back it wouldn't be much of a fight. I guess the stats probably reflect that too.

[Light]

Time to start citing sources. I am honestly curious to know more about this. While I've never acted violently toward my girlfriends I have taken more than a couple hits from them (and unsuccessfully dodged objects flying in my direction). Though if I ever did fight back it wouldn't be much of a fight. I guess the stats probably reflect that too.

I'm pretty sure the statistics I saw were only for the US. When you look at statistics for other countries, some of them are pretty disgusting. Some even show statistics even show women justifying it over stupid reasons towards a man's wife. There's worse than just beating too while looking this up.

But er, I'll need to get back to you on this. You can find some stats on Wiki though, but different studies show different things. Some put abuse on women abut 3x higher, and some have them about even. I think it depends on the definition during the time of the survey. But, when it comes to what Lucifer was talking about, I wasn't replying about actual harm done, but just to what could cause the police to take action.

Anyway, I can't look it up at the moment because I have to leave like 10 mins ago.

[Phytotron]

But when it comes to domestic violence, it's pretty even between both sexes. Some studies even show women having a higher rate, though it also shows more injuries by men onto women.

No, you're absolutely ******* wrong. If not "men's rights" sites, then where are you getting this garbage? I even gave you the statistic in my post. Eighty percent. How is 80% "pretty even?"

Well, perhaps it's explained by your being the typical male who, as a recent study shows, looks at a crowd comprised of 17% women and thinks it's 50-50, and when it's 33% women thinks that they're over-represented.

And this had nothing to do with the previous topics.

Of course it has. Your asinine, ignorant comment about, "well, women aren't raped as much as they say and hey men get raped too so it's pretty equal and not a big deal stop getting so upset."

So I'm supposed to walk around on eggshells for fear of offending anyone at all?

No, you're supposed to have some common ******* decency instead of being a narcissistic, nihilistic, privileged jerk unsympathetic to other people. I know, that sort of concept is hard for your generation to grasp. You people glorify and celebrate cruelty, humiliation, offensiveness, bigotry, ego, anti-social behavior, sadism. Take some goddamn responsibility, jerk, and try to develop a little humanity.

"Der, if I spit in someone's face, it's their own fault for not choosing to process and experience it as a drop of summer's rain. If I punch someone in the face, it's their own fault for not getting out of the way of my fist."

[ppotter]

But when it comes to domestic violence, it's pretty even between both sexes. Some studies even show women having a higher rate, though it also shows more injuries by men onto women.

No, you're absolutely ******* wrong. If not "men's rights" sites, then where are you getting this garbage? I even gave you the statistic in my post. Eighty percent. How is 80% "pretty even?"

You gave a statistic and didn't cite any sources; this article* was one of the first results when I googled "domestic violence men women". Admittedly that particular report wouldn't show up on the American google, but I imagine there are similar for your area.

I would also think that there are a greater number of unreported cases against men due to the social stigma attached, which may have skewed the stats further into women's "favour".

[Lucifer]

But when it comes to domestic violence, it's pretty even between both sexes. Some studies even show women having a higher rate, though it also shows more injuries by men onto women.

Time to start citing sources. I am honestly curious to know more about this. While I've never acted violently toward my girlfriends I have taken more than a couple hits from them (and unsuccessfully dodged objects flying in my direction). Though if I ever did fight back it wouldn't be much of a fight. I guess the stats probably reflect that too.

http://comics.davefancella.com/blog/abuse_culture.html

Sources cited. Women are more abusive, up to twice as much by some studies. It's pretty much proven, it's just a matter of getting some of you blockheads to see it.

[ConVicT]

I've always seen myself as a sneaker and not a splasher. smeghead

I really couldn't be bothered to read the whole thread but you've more than splashed me. More like water bombed me out of the Neighbourhood, on more than one occasion about my opinions, but obviously you must see some sense in them

Just quoted the smeghead part cuz i love Red Dwarf!