The Occupy Movement

[þsy]

Hopefully most of you have heard about this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupy_movement

What are your thoughts? Do you agree/disagree with the cause? Is there any hope or are they wasting their time?

[Kijutsu]

Movement lacks a proper spokesman, and goals.

[Lackadaisical]

It must be like organizing the ladle in real life.

[syllabear]

I don't understand why they're protesting, at least in the UK.

In the UK, the government pays you to try and find a job. If you can't, it's not like you're living in squalor.

From what I can see overseas (in the USA) there are a mixture of people who geniuinely have a just cause to be upset about their situation in life (although at the end of the day, lifes not fair), and then there are a bunch of university graduates/students who picked a stupid course and are whining about it not paying off in the end.

Perhaps some of the latter group (and the british-bitchers) can go do some charity work in Africa, South Asia or South America and get some perspective.

At the end of the day, this system wasn't thrust upon us, we had several chances along the way to stop it, but consumerism and greed bought us over.


I am the 1%

[Clutch]

Movement lacks a proper spokesman, and goals.

This.

I appreciate what they're trying to do, but right now it just looks like an unorganized mess. If they want to be taken seriously they're going to need to need a figurehead, and they're going to need a list of what they want to achieve.

[scene]

then there are a bunch of university graduates/students who picked a stupid course and are whining about it not paying off in the end.

Exhibit A:

[Phytotron]

Wrong. The fact that there isn't a single figurehead is part of what makes it a strong, truly grassroots democratic movement (as distinguished from the phony "astroturf" of the Tea Party, for example). It is organized—horizontally, with various local committees and general assemblies, among other groups and media outlets, rather than a top-down approach. Moreover, it shows what popular democracy looks like—of, by, and for the people—drawing a stark contrast with a plutocratic government Of businessmen, lawyers, and a revolving door of lobbyists; By the campaign coffers filled with corporate cash; and For Wall Street, big business, and the 1%.

"Many occupiers decline to offer specific demands, and that has helped this movement succeed by focusing outrage at the concentration of power and wealth among the 1%. The vagueness about demands allows everyone to see their particular issue as equivalent to everyone else’s, thus creating a broad movement that even extends to the right despite the anti-capitalist orientation." We're still in the coalescing stage.

Nevertheless, there are stated grievances and goals, especially within local occupy groups, if you'd take the time and effort to actually read.

And I already posted about this recently. Links. Read. So much more informative than some video game forum, seriously.

http://wearethe99percent.tumblr.com/
http://www.adbusters.org/campaigns/occupywallstreet
http://www.commondreams.org/occupy
Occupy Wall Street: The Most Important Thing in the World Now
http://occupylouisville.org/ (local shout out)

The Occupy movement is, in part, the heir to the alter-globalization movement that sprang up in the late '90s (but was killed in large part thanks to 9/11). And similarly, the corporate media are going to misunderstand, simplify, trivialize, and flat-out misrepresent it, as some of your statements reflect. Notice I didn't call it the "anti-globalization" movement? Because it never was, that was a corporate media slur, and it's happening now with these dismissals of the 99%'ers being a "disorganized, vague group of privileged hippies" and such. Actually visit one and you'll find people from all walks of life. In fact, I encourage (challenge?) each of you to go down yourselves and visit your local occupy demonstration and talk to people.


Note: I speak mainly about the US movement. Ones in other countries are naturally going to have some different characteristics due to different conditions.


Nice, obviously doctored pic, scene. More bigotry from you; shocker.

[þsy]

At the end of the day, this system wasn't thrust upon us, we had several chances along the way to stop it, but consumerism and greed bought us over.

It's the system that has produced the consumerist culture in the first place. Neoliberalism (which I don't believe is the real bad guy, but it's close enough) has created this crisis of capital and is inherently unsustainable. It's allowed the rich to get richer, whilst allocating all the power to them, which they've used to squash the voices of the "99%"

I can understand where the lack of clear objectives could be considered a problem, but I agree with Phyto on this (except the bit where he said that you're wrong, that wasn't very nice)

Here is an interesting article if you're interested:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ll-clinton

And yes, I have been camping in my local Occupy!

[syllabear]

Here is an interesting article if you're interested:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ll-clinton

Interesting if I'm interested? Anyway, I waded through that article, and the finish of the penultimate paragraph really just cinches it for me:

however, it is no less important to simultaneously remain subtracted from the pragmatic field of negotiations and "realist" proposals.

If you peel back the over-use of buzzwords and bluffing, he essentially asks to live in a dreamworld with no end in sight. This guy is talking out of his backside.

http://wearethe99percent.tumblr.com/

No information, just people complaining (some I empathise with, others I simply cannot)

http://www.adbusters.org/campaigns/occupywallstreet

movement for democracy that began in America on September 17 with an encampment in the financial district of New York City. Inspired by the Egyptian Tahrir Square uprising and the Spanish acampadas

Sorry but comparing the Wall Street 'movement' to their fight for democracy is simply insulting to everyone suffering around the world under oppressive learders. Also, America HAS democracy, but nobody has the brains to run a third party campaign, or support anyone else apart from lobby-representatives. If things are bad enough, you would elect someone else. And again, no more information, just propaganda.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2011/11/17-8

Finally, a source of information. Quite a lot of sourced (although not referenced ) information about income inequality here. Although again I am simply not sure how the Occupy movement really relates to doing anything about it. The old adage "actions speak louder than words" rings true: you may think standing around in a park or infront of a building is "actions" but surely actually improving local economies using ground-up projects, backing campaigners and local governments who want to do something about it, and many other things would be more useful. Sitting around asking for someone else to do it is exactly what got us into the financial crisis (let the banks sort out my money etc.), and realistically into the income inequality we see today.

Perhaps this movement can reshape from what it is now, into people actually taking an active stance on their lives, controlling what they spend to what they earn. And I know some people really have not got it right, but I am sure the vast majority of the "99%" could get by just fine on what they have, if they just made more sensible decisions.

[syllabear]

Aha, now I'm getting somewhere with the Louisville "Why occupy Louisville" document.

A list of demands requested by Wallstreet protestors. I'll have to do some research in this to re-evaluate my opinions. Potentially disregard my above post until further notie.

[þsy]

It's not a case of getting on fine with what the 99% have, it's that there shouldn't a 99%, or any class order. If you want to get into it at an academic level, have a watch of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7vppCnTu88

[syllabear]

It's not a case of getting on fine with what the 99% have, it's that there shouldn't a 99%, or any class order. If you want to get into it at an academic level, have a watch of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7vppCnTu88

Thats communism, which doesn't work. Sorry, but humans are not a hive mind, we are individuals. Here's the harsh fact: some people are better than others. Better at some things at least. What value we place on this is a problem (for example, placing huge value on being able to manipulate a football is just rediculous), but having a stratified population is the natural order of things.

[teen]

THe movement here in NYC is quite stupid. Its a mix of dumb rich kids who never went to college and bums who just found dumb rich kids to sleep in tents with.

All they are doing is yelling "WE ARE THE 99%".

THey are the 99% that do shit in this world but want shit handed to them for free. These people shit and piss on the same streets they protest in. Its been more than 2 months and when i went to do a report for school, i intervied a couple people.


out of those 99%,

ALMOST ALL OF THEM just said they just want to be part of history. When i asked what is the history in the making they replied, "Revolting against the franchises and big corporations." WHen i asked were do you eat? They replied "We live off mcdonalds."


--EDIT

I forgot to mention that one person said " I dont mind this many people protesting with me, but i mind the intelligence of the crowd and if they truly believe in what we are protesting about"

This man did not live in a tent and he shows up at protests because he actually has a job. He says he tries to support the protest but at the moment its become a ridiculous fashion statement.

Its a bunch of hippies and dropouts that want to be part of "history" and have their voice heard.

[þsy]

That might be true at that location, but it's not fair to sum up a movement consisting of 2000+ camps on an experience in one camp is it not?

[teen]

THe movement here in NYC i