The definition of racism;

[gawdzilla]

What makes someone a racist?

Lately, I've been the target of racist comments within armagetron (and in real life too) ((I'm not black but everyone knows the reason why they target it towards me so lets not get into that)), and when confronting these people they simply say "oh I'm not racist I was just angry" or "oh I was just saying those things". I figured you're at least a racist when you continuesly say the N word in a bad and annoying way, but I guess its not if its "just" said out of anger.

Anyways I'd like some more opinions on this so I can clarify it for myself and make some sense out of all this.

[Hoax]

everyone knows

I don't edit oh i do now

[Clutch]

Maybe it's because your the biggest bitch in the game.

Seriously though, I doubt anyone here cares about your little petty fights with hiro and spook.

[Paladin]

everyone knows

I don't

+1

Does appear to be some sort of clumsy ploy, but the validity of discussing the topic is fair, boxed, regardless of the intent of why it was created. So long as we avoid personal attacks and attempting to shame others it should be an interesting topic from a server admin point of view.

My view has always been the that the N word is off-limit. Simple as. It was used as a derogatory term for so long that it can no longer be used without that stigma being attached to it. Personally, I've found it the most confusing when someone uses it in-game, you ask them not to, and they respond, "It's ok. I'm black". Then you run into the variations ending in -ga and the fact that, apparently, combining a black person with KFC is racist now. "ObamaAteMyKFC" due to an Australian KFC commercial being combined, from what I read after one player's complaint, with America's south has entered in a new thing to watch out for. (Needs a facepalm emoticon here)

Are there other...geographical issues over in Europe or even in N.A that I'm not aware of?

[MrsKsr]

People seem to forget that racism isn't all about black people.. I'm just saying.. If we're going to talk about parameters of racism, we should be more general about it. (Black people aren't the only people who suffer from racism.)

Just thought that was worth adding if we want to get somewhere with this discussion :/

[gawdzilla]

No ploy here Paladin, just trying to understand this, for me, recent thing. o_O

[Word]

Racism is never good but it's true that you're not innocent and it's not difficult to understand why some people react like this after getting provoked several times. Racism isn't any better or worse than obscene jokes with sexual connotations to insult someone.

[Phytotron]

Paladin, there's a long-standing racist stereotype in the US concerning black folks and a penchant for fried chicken (likewise for watermelons). It's nothing new. Here's some comedy on it by Dave Chappelle.


The definition of racism

ra•cism n. 1. A belief that people differ significantly and systematically, as in ability, intellect, etc., because of racial differences. 2. A belief in or advocacy of the superiority or inferiority of a particular group on the basis of supposed racial differences; racial prejudice.

For elaboration: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism
And: A Guide to Racism 101 for Clueless White People, Written by a Slightly Less Clueless White Person
And: Cornel West
And: Tim Wise
And for a little humour relating to Dubstep's comment I tried to find a clip of this bit that this comedian Russell Peters does about Indian and Chinese internal racism, but unfortunately couldn't find that specific bit.



All that noted, I do suspect that, yeah, as usual there's probably some ulterior motive here from Liz. (If nothing else, "gee, how can I make trouble and stir up more controversy, contention, and 'drama' on the forum now?") Just recently she and the gang came into Mud Puddle when they noticed I was there. At one point I said something using the phrase "these people" or "you guys," having nothing remotely to do with race, and Liz was like, "OMG Phytotron you're racist? Phytotron is racist! Hey everybody, Phytotron is a racist!" I don't remember the exact wording or context (dlh could probably dig up the chatlogs if he were so inclined), but so...yeah.

Racism isn't any better or worse than obscene jokes with sexual connotations to insult someone.

Naive, simplistic statement.

[Word]

Racism isn't any better or worse than obscene jokes with sexual connotations to insult someone.

Naive, simplistic statement.

for example, what liz posted about me on vcl forums a few months ago.

[gawdzilla]

Omg, there isn't any motive, if anything I already said why I posted this: because I'm encountering it in tron and real life A LOT lately and I'm wondering where it's coming from all of the sudden. Like, I didn't think it was such a big issue or anything, so I'm curious what drives people to say it.. actual anger or they are actually a racist.

Yes, I agree 'normal' insults can be just as bad as racism but I'm not actually whining and telling people to stop, I laugh it off but after the 10th time I started wondering where it came so 1) I confronted the people like Z-Man said, but didn't get a reply so 2) made it public in a, attempting, neutral discussion.

Seriously, harass me all you want.. I'm not asking people to stop. Keep bringing the lulz.

[Phytotron]

Like, I didn't think it was such a big issue or anything, so I'm curious what drives people to say it.. actual anger or they are actually a racist.

You didn't think racism was a big issue?

[gawdzilla]

Like, I didn't think it was such a big issue or anything, so I'm curious what drives people to say it.. actual anger or they are actually a racist.

You didn't think racism was a big issue?

I didn't think it was still an ongoing problem, not as big as it used to be, back in the old days. So I was surprised when it suddenly started popping up after people found out some things about me.

Phytotron, would you say people who use the N word a lot in an angry way are racist or simply trying to piss people off or all of the above?

[Phytotron]

I didn't think it was still an ongoing problem anymore, not as big as it used to be back in the old days. So I was surprised....

That's naivete resulting from white privilege and basic myopia.

So Phytotron, would you say people who use the N word a lot in an angry way are racist or simply trying to piss people off or all of the above?

I think anyone willing to use racist or other bigoted (e.g., sexist/misogynistic, homophobic, xenophobic) terms or statements as an insult (without irony, sarcasm, or satire) is implicitly conveying and acknowledging that they have little to no objection to the values and attitudes from which those insults are derived, have little to no concern for the subjects of those insults and ideologies, and likely harbor some degree of support for those views. "What's the worst thing I can say to this person?"

I would say you should read some of the material (and branch from there) I linked to above.


So, you think you'll learn any lessons from this experience?

[Lucifer]

I'd throw on a definition of racism where it's hatred of a culture associated with a particular ethnic group (e.g. black culture, hispanic culture, etc.). With this definition, a person may truly believe that all people have rights and that no ethnic group is inherently superior to any other ethnic group but still find people of other ethnic groups repulsive because of their ethnicity.

I'll keep in mind this racism thing you're talking about, Liz. The level of homophobia in arma players is something I've already explored a bit. Racism and homophobia tend to go hand in hand, in my experience.

(Is now a good time to casually mention my two most recent ex-girlfriends are hispanic? , and I don't think one of them is going to stay an ex-girlfriend?)

[owned]

So Phytotron, would you say people who use the N word a lot in an angry way are racist or simply trying to piss people off or all of the above?

as an insult

That's the important part here. There are some people (in my school for instance) who just use it randomly to describe a black person because they think its cool.